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🎵Music🎵 🎵Music🎵 🎵Music🎵 🎵Music🎵 🎵Music🎵 🎵Music🎵 🎵Music🎵 🎵Music🎵 🎵Music🎵 🎵Music🎵 🎵Music🎵 🎵Music🎵 🎵Music🎵 🎵Music🎵 🎵Music🎵 🎵Music🎵 Welcome to Sure Foundation Baptist Church. Let's find our seats and open up our green hymnals up to page 413. We're going to sing Stand Up, Stand Up for Jesus. Page 413. 🎵Music🎵 🎵Music🎵 Stand up, stand up for Jesus. On the first. Stand up, stand up for Jesus, ye soldiers of the cross. Lift high his royal banner, it must not suffer loss. From victory unto victory, his army shall he lead. Till every foe is vanquished and Christ is poured in thee. Stand up, stand up for Jesus, the trumpet call obey. Forth to the mighty conflict in this his glorious day. He that our men now serve him against the numbered foes. Let courage rise with danger and strength to strength up close. On the last. Stand up, stand up for Jesus, stand in his strength alone. The arm of flesh will fail you, ye dare not trust your own. Put on the gospel armor and watching unto prayer. Where duty calls for danger, be never wanting there. Amen. Great singing this morning. Brother Robert, can you open us with the word of prayer? Amen. Second song this morning, page 397. Little is much when God is in it. Page 397, little is much when God is in it. Page 397, sing it out loud with me on the first. In the harvest field, now ripen, there's a work for all to do. Hark the voice of God is calling to the harvest calling you. Little is much when God is in it. Labor not for wealth or fame. There's a crown and you can win it if you'll go in Jesus name. Does the place you're called to labor seem so small and little known. It is great if God is in it and he'll not forget his own. Little is much when God is in it. Labor not for wealth or fame. There's a crown and you can win it. If you'll go in Jesus name. Are you laid aside from service, body worn from toiling care. You can still be in the battle, in the sacred place of prayer. Little is much when God is in it. Labor not for wealth or fame. There's a crown and you can win it if you'll go in Jesus name. On the last, when the conflict here is ended and our race on earth is run. He will say to all the faithful, welcome home my child well done. Little is much when God is in it. Labor not for wealth or fame. There's a crown and you can win it. If you'll go in Jesus name. Good morning everybody. Welcome to the foundation Baptist Church. Let's take our bulletin and go through the announcements. If you need a bulletin, just lift your hand up high. And one of the ushers will bring you a bulletin. There's a hand over there. There's a hand that I'm ignoring over there. There is one hand over there. All right. On our front cover we have our verse of the week. It says how shall they preach except they be sent as it is written. How beautiful are the feet of them that preach the gospel of peace and bring glad tidings of good things. Romans chapter 10 verse 15. There's a great scripture that we use out. On our inside page there we have our service times. 1030 a.m. for the morning service and Sunday evening service. 3.30 p.m. We'll be back in Joshua chapter number 7 tonight. Thursday evening bible study. We're going through the book of first chronicles. And we'll be in chapter 18 this Thursday. And our soul winning times are listed below. Brother Alex has put the soul winning locations inside the whatsapp group. How many groups were in there? I don't know. I don't know. We're listed below. Brother Alex has put the soul winning locations inside the whatsapp group. How many groups were in there? One. One mega? That might be enough for everybody. I can always add more. Okay. Okay. Cool. Is it supposed to rain? Abundance of rain? Okay. All right. All right. All right. All right. All right. All right. All right. Our praise report. You can see the salvations. We've got three already for the new year. And all the other attendance. Last week we were devastated by sickness. Of course. We got some of our families back. So I'm glad to see that. And we're still missing some. you're on track for that and I'm trying to beat my my time last year that I got every year I'm trying to just beat that beat that time that I got the year before but I don't know if I'm gonna beat the 24-hour one that some of the other guys have gotten but that's that's a goal to achieve all right but let's see January 18th is gonna be our Super Saturday this month from 12 to 3 we're gonna try to knock out the whole town of brush prairie brush prairie is just north of Vancouver here and it used to be the main way that you would get plate to battleground there was a the freeway the highway or whatever went through there then once they built that 503 that extends all the way out to battleground that used to be the bit once it once that bypassed it then nobody went through brush prairie anymore and it kind of just killed the town but there are still some people that live there like 2,000 or so people so I feel like in three hours we might be able to knock that town out and we'll figure out I haven't figured out where we're gonna break bread after that but from 12 to 3 we're gonna try to knock out brush prairie and I don't think we've ever gotten so many there before so I figured it'd be a good small town we could knock out that's fairly close to the church and let's see February 1st 2nd is the one-year anniversary of Indianapolis Indianapolis Church plant there will be sowing on Saturday lunch provided afterwards and a bowling alley that we rented out for says a couple hours but it's actually three hours I'll be ordaining brother Justin as the evangelist there on Sunday morning and I'll be preaching Sunday night and probably preaching with pastor Jim weeb on Sunday night so we'll see if he's able to come it's not for sure thing yet but hopefully that's the for sure thing so anyway speaking of him we're also having him preach our sweetheart banquet this year which is gonna be February 15th it's gonna be an Old West theme so you know get your cowboy boots out and polish them up and your your your hat your Stetson out and your big belt buckles that you didn't earn and you didn't go to the rodeo you weren't a champion but you know get them out anyway so we'll have a good time we'll eat some Western style food I guess and or maybe some Texas barbecue something like that and then he'll be preaching one of the services for us on Sunday be bringing his wife Judy with him so looking forward to that King James Conference way out in the distance there and be getting the financial letters out I think we're just gonna do it all across the board even if you don't ask for them we're just gonna give them to you anyway for the ties and offerings it you gave this last year so of course your family integrated use another baby rooms dad baby room as you need and all the rules are down below and the ties that came in for the month of December the full total at the bottom there on the other page there we got a couple birthdays and bill has not come home yet bill Bailey needs to come home it's time for supper now on bill Sweeney's birthday on the fifth and today or the fifth is also which is today is Tony's birthday so Tony is in the office there he's he's sitting among the stuff and it's old tones birthday how's Tony see what 35 today Tony are you 35 put a thumbs up I can see you yep he's 35 today well he's middle-aged he's halfway to his three score and ten so hopefully hopefully that's not true hopefully lives way longer than that let's go ahead and sing Tony happy birthday happy birthday to you happy birthday to you happy birthday God bless you happy birthday to you all right happy birthday Tony and happy birthday brother bill you need to come home we miss you all right that's all I got for announcements let's go ahead and sing another song and then we'll receive the offering all right if you have your Bible with you let's turn to Psalm 117 the shortest Psalm in the Bible as we all know now after the Bible trivia the shortest song about Psalm 117 all right see it out on that first Oh praise the Lord all ye nations praise him all ye people for his merciful kindness is great toward us and the truth of the Lord endure forever crazy crazy Oh praise the Lord all ye nations praise him all ye people for his merciful kindness is great toward us and the truth of the Lord endure forever crazy crazy and gracing this morning at this time we'll have the ushers come forward to receive the offering for us and brother Ramon can you bless it for us please in your house you you right open your Bibles to Genesis chapter 4 Genesis chapter number 4 you don't have a Bible there should be one under the seat in front of you in Genesis chapter number 4 Genesis 4 the Bible reads and Adam knew Eve his wife and she conceived and bear Cain and said I have gotten a man from the Lord and she be and she again bear his brother Abel and Abel was a keeper of sheep but Cain was a tiller of the ground and in process of time it came to pass that Cain brought of the fruit of the ground and offering unto the Lord and able he also brought of the first lings of his flock and of the fat thereof and the Lord had respect on the able into his offering but unto Cain into his offering he had not respect and Cain was very Roth and his countenance fell and the Lord said unto Cain why are thou Roth and why is thy countenance fallen if thou doest well shall thou not be accepted and if thou doest not well sin lieth at the door and unto thee shall be his desire and thou shall rule over him and Cain talked with Abel his brother and it came to pass when they were in the field that Cain rose up against Abel his brother and slew him and the Lord said unto Cain where is able thy brother and he said I know not am I my brother's keeper and he said what has thou done the voice of thy brother's blood crieth unto me from the ground and now art thou curse from the earth which hath opened her mouth to receive thy brother's blood from thy hand when thou tell us the ground it shall not henceforth yield unto thee her strength a fugitive and a vagabond shalt thou be in the earth and Cain said unto the Lord my punishment is greater than I can bear behold thou has driven me out this day from the face of the earth and from thy face shall I be hid and I shall be a fugitive and a vagabond in the earth and it shall come to pass that everyone that findeth me shall slay me and the Lord said unto him therefore whosoever slaeth Cain vengeance shall be taken on him sevenfold and the Lord set a mark upon Cain lest any finding him should kill him and Cain went out from the presence of the Lord and dwelt in the land of Nod on the east of Eden and Cain knew his wife and she conceived and bear Enoch and he builded the city and called the name of the city after the name of his son Enoch and unto Enoch was born Irad and Irad begat begat Mahugiel and Mahugiel begat Methusel and Methusel begat Lamech and Lamech took unto him two wives the name of the one was Ada and the name of the other Zilla and Ada bear Jabel he was the father of such as dwell in tents and of such as have cattle and his brother's name was Jubal he was the father of all such as handle the harp and organ and Zilla she also bear Tubalcain an instructor of every artisifer in brass and iron and the sister of Tubalcain was Nama and Lamech said unto his wives Ada and Zilla hear my voice you wives of Lamech hearken unto my speech for I have slain a man to my wounding and a young man to my hurt if Cain shall be avenged sevenfold truly Lamech seventy and sevenfold and Adam knew his wife again and she bare a son and called his name Seth for God she said had appointed me another seed instead of Abel whom Cain slew and to Seth to him also there was born a son and he called his name Enos then began men to call upon the name of the Lord brother Eli we pray for us thank you amen yeah there is a lot of doctrine in this chapter and I've preached out of this chapter actually quite a few times I was just I can't even remember the last time it was but I know I I preached against the serpent seed doctrine I I think it's the last one I preached out here but I could be wrong about that but this morning I'm gonna be preaching about children's free will children's free will and obviously everybody has free will but before we get into the chapter here I just want to have you turn to a couple passages here let's look at Ezra chapter 7 verse 16 Ezra chapter 7 16 keep your place here in Genesis we're gonna come right back to it but Ezra 7 16 Ezra 7 16 so verse 16 says and all the silver and gold that can't that thou can't find in all the province of Babylon with the free will offering of the people and of the priest offering willingly for the house of their God which is in Jerusalem now the word free will is in there that word is used in the Bible 17 times and it's usually about giving an offering once it's used as giving the free offering of their lips in one of the Psalms now then it says offering willingly so does that mean that you're forced to give something is that what that's saying there do you think that that's what it means that if you're giving something willingly is that something you're forced to do no the free will offering is something that you're giving of your own free will it's your discretion your choice to do that that's what free will means the ability to make decisions or act at one's own discretion and at this church we don't believe in Calvinism we don't believe that God just chooses people to be saved because he likes them for one reason or another now God looks down in the annals of time and he knows who is going to choose to be saved and who isn't going to choose to be saved that is true that's what we call the doctrine of predestination so God knows who's gonna be saved and maybe he does work it out so that person does get saved as far as like he makes sure that someone's gonna go to preach to them but also God offers salvation freely to anybody it's not like he doesn't give other people choices because then that wouldn't be really fair would it it's not like he just says okay I know that person is going to hell I'm never gonna send anybody to that person we go to people's doors all the time that reject the offer of salvation we preach the gospel to people and at the end they refuse to get saved all the time why because we're not walking up to people's doors with swords in our hand saying repent infidel and get saved we're leaving we're offering people a choice to be saved of their own free will now look at Joshua chapter 24 verse 15 Joshua chapter 24 verse 15 I believe a man is the one that's supposed to lead the house and while he's leading his house he leads his wife he leads his children and while his children are in his home he's gonna decide what church they're gonna go to he's gonna decide what is gonna happen in his house and Joshua you know this is one of the most famous verses in the whole Bible a lot of people have this hanging on their wall at their house it says in Joshua 24 verse 15 it says and if it seemed evil unto you to serve the Lord choose you this day whom you will serve does that say you have to do it or I'm gonna kill you no it's saying choose who you will serve whether the gods which your father served that were on the other side of the flood or the gods of the Amorites in whose land you dwell but as for me and my house we will serve the Lord so Joshua saying my choice is that I'm gonna serve the Lord and you know what my house is also going to do that as well but there is a time when our children leave our home and I've experienced this me and my wife live by ourselves together at our home because all of our children have moved away they've gotten married now they have children of their own and we don't make the choices that they make inside their homes that's their job that's their the husband of the home is is the person that makes the rules in their house now should they respect us and honor us as parents still absolutely but I don't tell them what to do in their marriage I don't tell them what church to go to I don't tell them how to do private devotionals in their own home or how to lead the Bible tells them now what they're supposed to do and all my kids are saved and all their spouses are saved so but I did best to raise up godly children and I you know what wasn't raised in a Christian home but I still got saved anyway even though the chances of being saved not being in a Christian home are very vastly different than those that are raised in a Christian home so but that word choose means to pick select or make a choice pick select or make a choice so Joshua says hey choose who what choose you this day whom you will serve God saying hey Joshua saying hey you have a choice you can choose who you want to serve you're not forced who you have to serve now choices come with consequences though don't they because God is the true God so the consequences of not choosing him you know people are like well that's a setup not really because you still have a choice if you want to choose the difference between right wrong you can choose the wrong thing but the choice at the end of that is that you're going to go to hell now in this life you're not going to be you're gonna be able to live your best life now so so to speak you're gonna enjoy the same benefits that everybody else gets to the sun's gonna rise up for you every week every day and you're gonna still get to enjoy the rain you know we we enjoy it a lot here apparently but you're gonna get to enjoy the same benefits that other people enjoy on this earth but when the end comes you have to die and go to hell but the people that are saved what they choose the Lord they're gonna go to heaven for all eternity so some things in life we don't have choices in though you can't choose to be born but you can choose to be born again that is a choice you have but you don't get to choose to be born you must have heard my sermon brother bill welcome back I was like come back brother bill anyway you can't choose to be born who your parents are what country you're born into what year you're born what color your skin is how rich or poor you are when you're born and many other things you can't just you can't make that choice you can choose whether to give the tithe as a free will off above the free will offering though I mean excuse me you can you can choose to give a free will offering above the tie though that you can choose but it's it's of your own free will you say well you know what I've been blessed and I'm gonna give a little bit more this is what the free will offering was now you also can choose whether you want to be saved and serve the Lord or not being saved is not serving the Lord being saved is being saved you get that baseline that everybody else gets the reward of eternal life but nobody can make that choice for you you can't make that choice for your kids they're not automatically saved because they come to this church they're not automatically saved because they live in your home or grow up in your home so this goes for anyone including children raised in Christian homes it's not automatic that your kids are gonna get saved now of course the probability of your children being saved being raised in a Christian home go up drastically and statistics just show that and I've already you know gone through statistics like that in sermons before but it's not guaranteed that they're gonna get saved just because they're in a Christian home so point number one this morning is even in a nearly perfect situation children can and will rebel against their parents even in a nearly perfect situation children can and will rebel against their parents let's look back at Genesis chapter number four verse one because I mean obviously Eve sinned in taking the fruit that she was not supposed to she taken and ate that God said that the day you do that you will surely die their spiritual soul died that day when and then she gave of her husband he took and ate it knowing what he was doing and he was held responsible for that you know all men passed that sin on to their children it doesn't pass from the mother to the children passes from the dad to the children why you know Eve's the one that did it first and she's the one that offered it to her husband but he knew better that's the day he knew more than she did he was made first so anyway look at Genesis chapter 4 verse 1 the Bible says and Adam knew Eve his wife and she conceived and bear Cain and said I've gotten a man from the Lord and she again bare his brother Abel and Abel was a keeper of the sheep but Cain was a tiller of the ground in the process of time it came to pass that Cain brought of the fruit of the ground and offering unto the Lord and Abel he also brought of the firstlings of the flock and of the fat thereof and the Lord had respect unto Abel and to his offering so both of these young men are brought up and raised in the same house Adam and Eve genetically are probably you know pretty close to perfect yes they've sinned and yes the earth is cursed because of what they done but they're still the earth is still probably a lot better in shape as than it is right now genetically they're way more perfect than our genes are right now they're probably alpha male or whatever you call the the female what's the like who knows what the female thing is or it's they're the dominant female anybody know I know Bobby knows what it is what it huh I don't think that's what it is but anyway huh what is it brother among do you know what it is anyway but you know the the most doll you know the the the greatest specimen of male and female basically on the earth at that time so I mean they have a lot of good things going for them they're in a near-perfect situation as far as and I look I think that Adam and Eve are saved I think that they're gonna be in heaven someday with a long line of why did you know I'm just kidding well what's wrong with you know I'm just kidding but you know I'm sure that they felt and feel pretty bad about what they've done but I still believe that they're saved God made coats of skins for them showed them the way of salvation that's a picture of course of Jesus covering their sins right so these boys are raised in the same situation by the same parents but they're vastly different aren't they says but Cain and his offering he had not respect verse 5 and Cain was very Roth because the Lord had respect unto Abel and his offering verse 4 and Cain was pouty he started pouting and and he was Roth the Bible says that means he was filled with wrath he was really angry that God would not accept what he did and isn't there a lot of people out there today that they're upset because they want to come to God the way they want to come to God and when it's not accepted by what the Bible says they get very angry about that don't they when we're talking to them at the door what we're saying does not they want something different they want a different God they want a different Jesus they want a different religion but it says and the Lord said unto Cain why art thou Roth so God speaks to Cain he actually talks with Cain he has a line of communication with Cain and he says and why is thy countenance fallen if thou doest well thou shalt not be accepted or shalt thou not be accepted if thou doest well what was he supposed to do he was supposed to bring a different offering wasn't he and it says and if thou doest not well sin lieth at the door and unto thee shall be his desire and thou shalt rule over him he's giving him an option here Cain is the firstborn Cain is the one that's supposed to be the one that is the inherit the brother that inherits the the double portion he's supposed to be the one that gets the blessing if you think of Jacob and Esau he's supposed to be the one that carries on the family name he's supposed to be the chosen seed really because you know Adam and Eve Eve is supposed to be the one but obviously that hasn't been revealed quite yet well maybe it has yeah in chapter 3 but Cain is supposed to be that person but he's obviously not he's not wanting to go along with God's program and so it says and unto thee shall his desire so be his desire and thou shalt rule over him so he's saying hey Cain if you do well if you do what you're supposed to do you're gonna be the one that's leading this family next and Cain talked with his with Abel his brother and it came to pass when they were in the field Cain rose up against Abel his brother and slew him he wrote he remember he was Roth so obviously he doesn't take God's advice he doesn't do well he internalizes his anger and he takes it on his brother and he murders him and it says and the Lord said unto Cain where is Abel thy brother and he said I know not am I my brother's keeper and he said what hast thou done the voice of thy brother's blood cryeth unto me from the ground so his blood is speaking to God it's it's crying out to him it's it's not like weeping but it's crying out that something has been done to him and it says and now art thou cursed from the earth which hath opened her mouth to receive thy brother's blood from thy hand when thou tillest the ground it shall not henceforth yield unto thee her strength a fugitive in a vagabond shalt thou be in the earth so two types of people same parents same upbringing same place same environment same access to God God speaks to Cain God obviously speaks to Abel but something goes wrong with Cain what's wrong with Cain I thought you know if he was raised in a godly home he's gonna obviously turn out and get saved too right wrong that's not what happens because Cain has a choice just like everybody else on this earth when he gets the opportunity to be saved even God just says hey if you just do the right thing if you do well then you're gonna be accepted but he doesn't want to do that he wants to come to God on his own terms and offer him up the works of his own hands his little vegetable garden his little vegan diet you know he doesn't want to kill the innocent with a wham he wants to do his own picture and that's the picture of work salvation he wants to go his own way he wants to walk away from the things of God look at verse 16 it says and Cain went out from the presence of the Lord he went out from the presence of the Lord that means he doesn't want to be he doesn't want to know God he doesn't want to be it's like what reprobates do right they don't want to have the knowledge of God in their minds at all they want and so Cain is obviously a reprobate and dwelt in the land of Nod on the east of Eden he got away from the presence of God because he doesn't want anything to do with it he made his choice and he murdered his brother so Cain is the first false prophet in the Bible and the Bible is very clear that he's a false prophet it mentions him only in a negative light in the New Testament and Abel is the first prophet Jesus says I think when he's talking about the the all the righteous blood from Abel to Zechariah the son of Barachias or whatever that was slain at the altar Abel's the first prophet that's mentioned that the blood will be required of that generation so Abel's the first prophet right so two vastly different people exact polar opposites of each other a reprobate false prophet and a righteous prophet of God living in the same house raised by the same parents how do you explain that free will choice well I just think that Adam and Eve they just raised them differently do you have evidence of that I you don't have evidence of that they probably raised them exactly the same or pretty close maybe you know when you make recipes you know maybe you don't always make the recipe the same way maybe you throw a little bit of dash of something else and maybe it's a little taste a little different sometimes and and here the thing is with parents we learn from some mistakes you know with the first kid obviously that is true but you know it's not so vastly different that they're gonna be you know that all the other kids are gonna turn out different from that first one it's still the same recipe for the most part obviously there's different variables in life you get saved maybe at a different point in your life when the kid the first kid born wasn't you know necessarily you're in your saved life or whatever I understand there's all different variables okay but in general you know most Christian families if they're all the kids are raised in the same capacity there's maybe a little bit of variables they're all gonna they have a better chance of getting saved in a Christian home but I wasn't raised in a Christian home I got saved when I was 25 years old who who was not raised in a Christian home here and Wow okay lots of people and so most people that weren't raised in a Christian home don't get saved early in life if they do they got saved on a bus route or they got saved in Sunday school or something like that who was not raised in a Christian home and you got saved before you were 18 raise your hand okay just a couple people who got saved as an adult quite a few people okay so when you're not so you see we've all those people that were not raised in a Christian home you get saved later in life but who was raised in a Christian home and got saved young raise your hand see there's oh you know that's a lot of people so yeah you see that you see the house the statistics the statistics are actually correct about those things so but how do you explain people that are raised in an atheistic family or a non-believing household and those people end up getting saved well it's the power of the Word of God it's the power of free will it's the power of your choice at the end of receiving the gospel the Word of God is very powerful we still get a choice you know even though all these things are stacked up against the unbelieving person that's raised in unbelieving households somehow the power of the gospel shines through in your life somehow and you end up getting saved so and look I would read I'd prefer that kids would get saved children get saved at an early age growing up in a Christian household but that's not always how things work out so why did Cain become the first false prophet enable the first profit how do you explain that well again free will so let's look at Hebrews chapter 11 verse 4 Hebrews chapter 11 verse 4 I'm gonna read for you first John 3 12 not as Cain who was of that wicked one and slew his brother wherefore slew he him because his own works were evil and his brothers righteous that's what it came down to and really you know you're gonna be persecuted if you're saved by the people that hate God Hebrews 11 4 says by faith Abel offered unto God a more excellent sacrifice than Cain by which he obtained witness that he was righteous so Abel was saved he was righteous God testifying of his gifts and by it he being dead yet speaketh so even though he's been dead for probably longer than anybody else he's the first person that actually died a physical death in the whole Bible think about that he's been dead longer than anybody but yet he still speaks to you this morning he still his testimony of him being righteous right there in that verse still speaks to you this morning his blood spoke to God in his death and and Cain was rebuked look at Jude 1 11 Jude 1 11 Jude 1 11 the Bible says whoa unto them but they've gone in the way of Cain and ran greedily after the error of Balaam for reward and perish in the gain seeing of core the context of this passage here is talking about false prophets people that would creep in these are it's basically giving you three types of false prophets and the first one it mentions is Cain well it says for they have gone in the way of Cain what was the way of Cain well says Cain went out from the presence of the Lord Cain is a person that lived in a in probably a godly household his brother was a godly man and then he decided to offer up false works salvation and his message was false works and that once he was discovered how wicked he was he went out from the presence of the Lord this is what false prophets do in our world today same thing they offer up and tell people about false works salvation and then they go out from among us because they're not of us right so the way of Cain is going out from the presence of the Lord so was God a good father to Adam and Eve do you think he was would anybody dispute that God is a good father God is a good father do you think he was a good father to Adam and Eve I agree I think he was were they in a perfect environment God said that everything that he made was good he rested on the seventh day everything was good so how much more perfect of a dad could they have had I mean he's God you can't have any more perfect of a god or a dad yet they rebelled yet they rebelled so do you see the free will the free choice that we have even under all those wonderful conditions God just said that's the only thing you can't do you can't eat from that tree what do they do like every other dumb human we do the thing that we're told not to do it's like duh but that's what happened did God know that was gonna happen I think he did I think it and then the the plan of salvation was was put together before the foundation of the world so he already knew you're like well that makes him a monster no it doesn't it makes us monsters really they we screwed it up but did God do it though did God make the choice though no he gave us the choice and we made the choice Adam and Eve made the choice so did he do it or did his creation rebelled through the free will that was given to them the creation rebelled through the free will that was given to them they were in a perfect environment folks so in a perfect environment with the best parents ever the best dad ever you can still rebel so there's this just this weird teaching out there today that's saying if you have this perfect Christian home or you're in this perfect environment that your kids will always turn out right is that true it's not true and it's just it's a bizarre teaching it's more true than if you're raised in some heathen home raised by drug dealers or something or murderers or a you know a mafios mafia boss or something yeah your chances of getting saved are gonna be a lot less as opposed to being raised in a great Christian home or the where the parents are doing their very best to raise them according to the Bible but we're not perfect parents are not perfect we are gonna make mistakes we are gonna mess up some of the things we're not always gonna be the perfect picture of God we're not we're gonna make mistakes but people will say well well if it wasn't for that one mistake you made your parent your kid probably got saved how dare you say that how dare you say that to some to someone but that's kind of the teaching that's out there there's this there's really two different teachings you're killed you're if you do all the right things your kids will always get saved and turn out right you might as well be a Calvinist if you believe that you're taking away the free choice that kids have to get saved that's what you're doing again I think that your your your stats are real high to raising your kids right and they will get saved I I do believe that but to say that they're never gonna go astray they're never gonna walk away they're never gonna live a bad life they're never gonna even just get saved and just walk away from the faith for a while and come back have you ever read the prodigal son parable before that he was a son when he left and the father was like this with open arms come on back boy and the one that was always doing right was all pissy about it and he was mad he never slayed the fed cat for me father so that me and my friends could make Mary he's he's he's hating on his on his brother they got right with God and came back because he was the good son that always did all the good things right and look there's always look both of them are sons though aren't they both of them are saved aren't they but one chose to live his life for God which is good and the father in that story is just like hey you you're you hey I love you too but you know I love him too it's like God loves both but what happened to the one that went astray it's not like his life was really great while he was a stray he ends up eating the same food that the pigs are eating and and living with pigs I mean pigs are filthy animals and they wallow and they roll around in mud and their own dung they're pretty gross they're cute when they're little babies like that movie babe when it's when he's a little baby he's cute but when they get big they're ugly and they stink all right so I had a friend they used to accuse God to me and I was trying to get the guy saved is when I was a new Christian and he said God doesn't set you up for failure so his problem was that God put that tree in the garden and told them not to eat of that fruit more specifically and he was like this rapper guy and he would say fathers don't set you up for failure and he would just like repeat that little chant to mock me so you'd say specifically fathers don't set you up for failure so his gripe against God was that if a good father wouldn't set you set a kid up and put something in a place and say don't touch that no that's but that's not true he's report he was referring to putting the tree of knowledge of good and evil in the garden to tempt them but our life is filled with temptation God does put things in our lives to tempt us and you think that that's weird but it's not it's a trial of our faith it's like hey tithe and and you know I'll take care of you no matter what and people are like I don't know it's not working out right and then God says I will pour you out a blessing that is a trial of your faith it is and so and that's just a small trial of your faith but think about job you've heard of the patience of job all the things he went through but in the end everything worked out for the good for him so but this guy he was just like saying all these horrible things about God he's basically saying he's basically saying to me that the real God wouldn't do that so he refused to believe that the God of the Bible is the real God because the real God wouldn't do that so essentially he was saying the God of the Bible isn't really God which the guy's a reprobate for sure and you know but I tried to work on him for a long time he just wasn't having it but there's other people that hate God like Richard Dawkins who says that he's a masochistic sadistic megalomaniac megalomaniacal racist misogynist homophobic psychopathic ethnic cleanser and mass murderer I mean really just rails against God the God of the Bible he'll have a really dark hot place in hell to go to for all the people he's turned away from the Lord but what is the answer to this thought process of that God it's God's fault that all these people are dying it's God's fault well the answer to that is free will free choice God did not want a creation of robots that serve him because we have to he wants us to choose him he wants us out of our own free will and of our own free discretion to choose to love him to choose to want to be saved by him free will is a gift of God it really is but if you choose foolishly it can be the curse of God so free will is it you know we have we have a choice you know other gods of other religions you don't get a choice it served me and then ultimately offer some innocent person's blood on an altar and pull out their still-beating heart and burn it with fire and I mean most religions in the world were like that at some point sacrificing children sacrificing innocent people sacrificing virgins or whatever just wicked demonic gods is what they were you know who's heard of the age of accountability in here does anybody know what the age of accountability is I mean in the Bible to pay taxes for the temple tax you had to be 20 years old to join the military 20 years old I'm not saying that's the aging it's a the age of accountability for certain things but spiritually I believe it's when you can understand the gospel and that's different ages for different people but at that age of accountability whose choice is it to be saved is it your choice for them to be saved because if a kid can understand the gospel at six years old like Remy then he was responsible to believe that or not it wasn't you know I I'm responsible to show my kids the gospel teach my kids the gospel to try to get them saved that's my job as a parent or take him to a place so they can get saved I mean Nia was led to the Lord by a pastor's wife at Riverview Baptist Church and in Pasco and she I believe was baptized there too I think but Remy you know he was baptized at a different church but look all my kids read Joshua was led to the Lord by his mom at a camp and you know I mean everybody gets you know saved in different places different by different people or whatever but it's my responsibility to make sure it happens but I'm just saying the age of accountability comes upon someone and they are accountable they have to make the choice we cannot make the choice for them you know and and look parents just a word of wisdom to you don't just think they're saved because you just want to believe it or something make sure that they are okay and and don't just trust some willy-nilly altar call worker look you're not gonna have to worry about that here but like look at other Baptist churches it's a you're not sure who's dealing with your child and you know I've been to many VBS's where they have some altar call workers not even saved trying to give people the gospel so anyway let's think about some other sons in the Bible Noah's sons Shem, Japheth and what's the other one's name Ham do you think Noah was a good dad what's up with ham well weirdo creeping in on the he had a wife how could he be gay if he had a wife well yet he's queering away on his own dad after he gets drunk you know the Bible says and he knew he woke up from his wine and knew what his son had done to him the Bible doesn't say what he did it just but no one knew the Bible uses the euphemism of looking upon his nakedness but he did something more than just look at him because everybody accidentally sees their parents think it every once in a while you know it happens but that doesn't mean you're cursed and that your grant your children are cursed because of that because they accidentally saw something they shouldn't saw whatever this is different so is it Noah's fault that Ham was a reprobate I mean he had two other good sons Shem was where the blessing the the the line of the Savior came through what about Abraham's son Ishmael he was actually the firstborn he was the wife of the son of a concubine Hagar and then he's teasing Isaac when he was weaned messing with him which you know probably would have got worse as time went on and what God say cast out the bond woman and her son now I'm not saying Isaac was some evil reprobate I mean Ishmael was some evil evil reprobate I don't know but but Abraham still cared for him he said oh that Ishmael would live and then God said well I'm gonna bless him in his own way but he needs to get away from your son right but if he's bad enough that he has to be thrown you know they have to get away from you for whatever reason then there's obviously something wrong there Isaac had two twins the firstborn was who Esau he came out all red and hairy and then his nickname was Edom which means red he came and so they weren't identical twins then Jacob came holding on to his heel all right and Esau despised his birthright and sold it for a bowl of gross beans lentil soup right which turns into what does not turn into hummus if you smash it up or is that a different kind of being different kind okay well I don't like those those beans in either so anyway that's my that's my hatred of those types of beans but I mean at least I would get some kind of venison like Isaac liked you know and trade for it but but he despised his birthright that means he hated it he hated his birthright and so he did not care for the things of God he sold it for a bowl of beans say he was gonna die I'm gonna die I doubt he was really that hungry that's what something the kid would do I'm so hungry mom I'm gonna die I need something to eat and kids really do say stuff like that like okay sit down it'll be all right and he was tricked out of the blessing because once he got the the birthright away from us like well I might as well get the blessing too you know and Esau he was upset about that because he wanted the blessings that came with it but he didn't want the birthright he didn't want the responsibility he wanted the the monetary things that came with it the the double portion all that and then he chooses wives from the heathen which were a grief of mine to his parents I'm not saying Esau was all bad or he was a reprobate some people think he was some people you know it's who he ends up forgiving his brother and being nice him or whatever but Jacob doesn't end up going back home with him he kind of splits off and goes to his own spot but and then Esau ends up you know being you know becoming this wicked nation later but who's you know they're twins raised by the same parents Isaac and Rebecca he didn't have a bunch of wives it was just them two and Isaac was a godly man he pictured Christ at you know the sacrifice that Abraham was supposed to sacrifice him he was obedient to his father he laid there and let him bind him up and was ready to get sacrificed he digs the wells picturing soul winning he you know he was a great man and then he has a little brat named Esau what what why was one so different from the other one became this great nation with the the twelve tribes of Israel and one is a jerk you know so number two this morning what about the verse train up a child and people will use this verse and look if you believe that this verse is a promise then I'm not mad at you at all or anything like that some people think it is but I don't think it's necessarily a guaranteed promise because of everything I just got done telling you because of free will look at Proverbs chapter 22 verse 6 Proverbs chapter 22 verse 6 it's like that that verse that says evil and bloody or wicked and bloody men will not live out half their days is that a promise does that always happen the Joseph Stalin only lived till he was 35 he was a pretty bloody man what about you know some people like Alexander the Great he didn't live out half his life that's true but you can there's there's people you know that will live till there are 90 or 100 years old I mean you want to talk about a spiritually bloody person how about Billy Graham he lived to be what 90 hundred years old or something like that just sending people to hell all the way there I mean it's not he wasn't literally a bloody man but he sent a lot of people to hell so Proverbs 22 6 says train up a child in the way he should go and when he is old he will not depart from it so I do know that there's preachers and there's people that believe that this is a just a guaranteed promise that if he trained a child in the way you should go he will not part from it but notice it says when he's old people forget about that part you know when he's old he won't depart from it well what does that mean that when he's 20 years old he's just gonna live for Jesus is that when you're old or it could it I mean you can spiritualize this verse too can't you when you train them or you you train them to be in in the way can mean salvation when they're old they're not gonna depart from it like they're they're gonna have everlasting life if you if you spiritualize this verse then you teach someone how to be saved they're gonna get saved and they're gonna live forever right I mean I've never seen anybody apply it that way but it could be applied that way but how most of the time people apply it is that if you train your children right they're never gonna they're never gonna move away from that ever they're always gonna do what's right but is that actually true does that always happen is it a guarantee is it a promise well Jacob had 12 sons do you think he was a horrible father I mean I'm sure he made some mistakes I know he did but so do you and so have I Jacob had 12 sons and one daughter and that one daughter committed fornication with a heathen in the land 11 of his sons were arguably pretty wicked I mean they conspired to sell Joseph and actually they conspired to murder Joseph first and then one of them that was a little more even keeled said well let's just sell him we split the money I mean he was Joseph was a prophet Joseph was tattling on them but in reality he was telling his dad hey these guys are doing some wicked things behind your back dad and they were all pretty wicked now I think that later in life when they were old they didn't depart from it you know they did clean up their life a little bit but I mean Simeon and Levi went in and killed every man in Shechem because of that guy laying with his sister and Jacob said you make my name to stink in the land God had to go in and protect them supernaturally so that the the nation's didn't rise up and murder their whole family so I mean they did some pretty bad stuff but so I mean Jacob did do you think Jacob raised his children in the ways of the Lord I think he probably did now he had two he had two wives and he had concubine wives so he had four wives basically two of them they didn't have a choice in the matter they were basically bond bond maids and the two bond maids had the most wicked kids and you know the the best ones came from Leah really but Benjamin you know he was he was hit Benjamin and Joseph were from were from Rachel Rachel died in childbirth so Joseph really was the only really good kid out of all of them and he basically sold all of Egypt and gave Pharaoh all them all the all the land of Egypt and basically turned them all into slaves so he had his own hang-ups right so again I believe but is that tarnished Jacob is Jacob a bad person does does the Bible paint Jacob as a bad person at all no he's he's called Israel because he is a prince among the people he's called he changed his name to Israel he wrestled with the angel of the Lord he wrestled with the Lord Jesus Christ and would not let go of him until he gave him a blessing until Jesus had to apply the submission hold on him and pop his hip out of socket and he had a permanent limp from there on out I mean Jacob was a great man of God but he had 11 12 fairly bad kids so I've gone to plenty of churches where the youth once outside the confines of their parents rules leave the church and never come back plenty of churches like that old IFB churches how do you explain that according to that verse did all the parents just do a crappy job of raising their kids is that was that what and look that's that's the that school of thought what a pastor that believes that that verse is a promise no matter what says is well then you failed somewhere as a parent that can be true you can be a hypocrite at home and come to church and be a different person and your kids see that and they're like I don't want to be a hypocrite like my parents are that can turn your kids away from the faith so don't be like that but what if you you're that parent that does do everything right and then maybe one or two your kids go to the world or whatever or one doesn't get saved or a couple don't get saved look you could beat yourself up for the rest of your life for that because you're misapplying that verse now again if you believe that and you're like pastor Thompson I think you're out to lunch on this I don't think you're correct in this well that's fine but just know this that it is kind of a Calvinistic doctrine to believe that no matter what if your kids raised in a Christian home and you've raised them completely to go to church and do all the right things that they're gonna get saved no matter what isn't that true so because that one school thought is that if you train your children in a Christian home they will be saved and live a great fulfilling and fruitful Christian life and that's a fact because that's what the Bible says and if any of your kids go astray you as a parent did something wrong with that child and you bear the blame forever and the guilt and the shame of it somehow just just keep beating yourself up over that look you have them for a certain amount of time there's a lot of families in here with the young children yes do your best but if one or a couple of your kids just don't do what you thought they were gonna do look you have to just put all your energy into the ones that will sometimes things go wrong sometimes they just don't do what you think they're gonna do look at Deuteronomy chapter 24 verse 16 Deuteronomy chapter 24 verse 16 there's tons of verses that teach what I'm about to show you right here but we should understand this Deuteronomy chapter 24 verse verse 16 the Bible says the fathers shall not be put to death for the children neither shall the children be put to death for their fathers every man shall be put to death for his own sin so what is that teaching we are responsible for our own actions we are responsible for our own sin we're not responsible for what other people do now as the man of the house you're responsible for your children to hear the gospel to warn them about sin just like it's my job as the preacher to you know to be that watchman on the wall and to preach and warn our church members about sin and and you know it's supposed to be reprove rebuke exhort with all long-suffering doctrine that's my job but if I've done that and people still go astray and people still do things that I'm supposed to do that's not my fault I'm not guilty of that I can just say hey I've done I've warned and they did not listen God does not hold me responsible for that and if you've done your job as a parent that is not your problem anymore I'm not saying you're not gonna worry and fret over your children that have issues I'm just saying that you shouldn't beat yourself up to the point where you act like well I failed in my training some way but if you are failing in your training some way you need to fix that part so you're like well pastor I'm confused do what the Bible says to the best of your ability teach them train them discipline them love them exhort them encourage them it's got to be a balance you can't just be disciplined only there's got to be love and discipline and encouragement so it can't it has to be a balance but if you're doing all those things you're bringing your kids to church you're teaching them the Bible you know you've done a good job comparatively to most of the world so the other school thought is that it's a general principle but not a hundred percent guarantee which verse well the one where if you train to put child away you should go when he's old he won't depart from it so meaning that while diligently raising a child with good values it's likely to lead to positive outcomes it does not guarantee the child will always follow that path parents cannot control their children's ultimate choices when they become adults that's true you cannot control them and you're not supposed to but this is one of the one of the things I deal with with marriage things is that parents just like to get involved in their children's relationships and the children of those parents like to involve their parents in those relationships and it does cause problems so what is the nature of a proverb well proverbs are typically not meant to be absolute promises all the time I'm not saying that some of them aren't but rather observations about life that are general generally true generally true so the parental responsibility the verse emphasizes the importance of parents actively guiding and teaching their children and again it says when they are old they won't depart from it so it doesn't say when they're young they're gonna do everything the Bible says it says when they're old I mean you know what people look like when they're old when their beard starts to get gray look at Alex I'm just kidding sorry brother Alex I know you can take it it's like one of the only people that's older than me that I can pick on so but look I just don't want you to set yourself up and think something that you know is is just not true or set set yourself up for like a lifetime of guilt and shame if something goes wrong and look kids I want to warn you to just follow the Lord all your life get saved young and follow the Lord with all your heart and take it from someone that didn't live a good life when he was first growing up but I know what that world is like and you know why I choose to stay in this life as a Christian and not want to walk off like Cain to the land of Nod because I know what's in that life I've been in that life before I know where it leads and it leads to death it leads to addiction it leads to you know a like a living hell I've had friends of mine that were I would consider my best friends killed themselves over addiction I've had friends that have died getting hit by cars hit run and and killed and left for dead and died died in my cousin's arm died because they got in a fistfight with my brother because he was drunk I mean I don't want to go back to that I don't want to go back to having to worry about stuff like that because and like Gabe preach a sermon last week in the men's preaching night about alcohol he's never touched and I hope he never does it's a it's a poison it's a deadly poison at the end is the is the way of death you want to just you know say pervert perverted things and and do perverted things and get in fights that you don't remember and all this other stuff yeah just yeah I just want to experience life pastor that's not life that's death so yes you I mean you just want to experience something other than Christianity well it's it's a hard road and look there are Christians that are saved and they get away from God and they get backslidden like the prodigal son but how did it turn out for him when he said I'll just give me the inheritance now I'll just take the inheritance now man how did all when all the money ran out and all his friends left him because he didn't have any more money and then he's feeding pigs and he's sleeping with the pigs and living with the pigs he's like oh yeah I'll just go and be a hiring servant for my father he'll just take care of me you know no not realizing his dad is gonna like give him a ring give him a fresh set of clothes and and slay the fattened calf and and have a big party for him he's God's ready to bring you back well you don't want to go down that path because you know what sometimes you don't come back from that path some people don't come back because you can die doing stuff like that you can die going out and drinking and partying and whoring around you can catch a disease that there is no cure for you can catch a disease that will not it someone that knows you have it will never want to be your spouse how would you like that you probably wouldn't like it you carry it forever and then you have to tell the person that you want to marry that you have something that you're gonna give them if you marry them that they're gonna get to and that person's not gonna want to marry you it's just that simple so warning to the children hey don't go astray do what your parents say do what the Bible says but get saved but you can't control your your children's lives the unsaved they sit and worry have your knows how people just worry about their kids the unsaved just pray for my son that he's you know the children they just fret and worry why because they're unsaved and they just worry about all these different things which save people worry about these things to save people worry about their children messing up job was like hey I'm gonna sacrifice for all my kids just in case they've cursed God in their hearts jobs worried about his children and does these sacrifices just in case because he's thinking about his children he wants them to be on the right path but our you know there's our worldly concern but our when Christian parents fret about their kids are like I hope he keeps going to church I hope they don't turn liberal and stop being Baptist I hope they keep reading that old boy King James they don't get on you know they don't listen to James White and get tricked or something I hope they remain married most unsafe people don't think about that I hope they're teaching their children about Jesus instead of playing silly songs or whatever I hope they're teaching that you know I hope they're they serve the Lord for the rest of their life and not just go off and do whatever they want they do though David and Saul two extremes were they both saved they're both sons aren't they one was a man after God's own heart one was a man that God wanted to grab out reach out and grab his heart one end up God's end up ends up killing because he goes to a witch and one is he makes a covenant forever with both are saved is God not a good father because his first two children rebelled against him if you count Cain his first three I mean do you see the silliness of where this goes if you're gonna say God's not a good father because his first three children rebel against him do you see the silliness of saying it about a human being his fourth is murdered by the third because God doesn't have grandchildren all of his children are sons and daughters God's family of children has some pretty messed up lines and their children Samson and Saul killed themselves and were also extremely disobedient to God but that's God's fault isn't it no I don't think it is was he a good dad to them is he a good father but some people would say well that's not a good father he doesn't deserve to be called the father because of his kids going astray you see how foolish that is because we have free choice we have free will and we have the ability to choose each individual has the right to choose we can't choose it for them we're responsible for what we have in our household and once they move out once they become adults they have their own free will I don't want to preach this sermon for a while because sometimes I just it's mind-numbingly stupid how how people think and act about this subject it is it's like well how is this possible that four children could actually go astray it's possible because look just read stories of the Bible it's absolutely possible what are you talking about turn it Hebrews 12 6 to the high and lofty ones it's not possible yeah and when your kids haven't gone astray it's how about if you've never raised teenagers it's impossible for that to happen but wait till you raise teenagers and then you've been sitting here railing Hebrews 12 6 says for whom the Lord loveth he chasteneth and scourgeth every son whom he receiveth we all get beat if you endure chasing God dealeth with you as with sons for what son is he whom the father chasteneth not oh guess what we all get spanked we all get scourged but if you be without chastisement where of all our partakers then you're are you bastards and not sons see there's a lot of bastards out there that aren't getting chasing because they're not really saved but you know what if you're saved you are gonna get scourged by God scourged by God that means whipped and you're gonna get chastened spanked with the rod of correction so you know the Bible has spoken you're like Jesus would never scourge us what's the Bible say it says he scourges people says he scourges every son whom he receiveth every every age as soon as your child becomes a son of God or a daughter of God they get scourged they get chastened they get whipped so not only to get spankings on earth when your kids but you also get spankings by God you know based upon your understanding of course things like that so even the best son or daughter gets the whip or the paddle from time to time even the best and if you just think about this in your own home I'm sure if you have children you go to this church or any other church that you have children that you spank more than the others that's not fair you should spank them all equally no some are more well-behaved than others some listen some don't some listen the first time some it takes ten times you know it's all kids are different just like all God's children are different aren't they some are you know some are King Saul and some are Samson and some are David some are job it just depends we're all different but everybody gets whipped but in my house Remy got spanked the most hands down easy Josh the second most Jasmine when she lives in our home third most Nia the least of all innocent little Nia she's in the she's in the room over there I probably I mean I just I can't remember how many times I ever spanked me in in her life but I would say probably ten times maybe in her whole life she was like really well-behaved she slept as a baby she slept in her own crib she was just she was really well-behaved I I remember having a spanker I mean I remember the spankings I had to give her just because there were so few I was said I didn't remember but there's ones I do remember specifically one where she's throwing a fit in church wearing this pretty the prettiest white dress ever and she's just freaking out in church and the Sunday I think was in the Sunday morning service and as when she had a I don't know why she had to be up there but she did and she starts freaking out and throwing a fit she's like going no no no no no and so I have to take her out in front everybody watching and I took her in the bathroom and I spanked her and yeah it was bad but she just yeah that was just one of the few times that I ever had to spank her but you know some kids just get spanked more than others so what about the angels that kept not their first estate is God a bad God because a third of them left heaven and rebelled against them and Satan the anointed cherub that covereth lost his position and God had to denounce him and is that God's fault was God wrong is God disqualified for being God because of that is Jesus disqualified because the people that got saved get backslidden he's the Good Shepherd he's supposed to be leading us well how come we disobey free will that's why yet people put a higher standard on sinful men on sinful pastors on sinful Christian families than they do on God it's bizarre it really is so number three and I'm gonna try to hurry just through this really quickly punishing children because it does apply okay I believe that just go to Ephesians 6 verse 4 it says any father's gonna run through this real quick any fathers provoke your children not provoke not your children to wrath but bring them up in the nurture and admonition of the Lord so obviously we don't want to provoke our children to wrath we're supposed to nurture them admonish them and it's not just about discipline but love and encouragement to go with it I X I used to explain to them why I was giving them the spanking then I would whoop them then one hug them and tell them I love them and I would encourage them to do better next time so I was you know obviously I didn't always do that I'm not a perfect parent sometimes you know you spank and you're angry but I did as time went on tried to learn to not do that and if I was really mad I would wait sometimes hours or a day before just because you know I want to get in some rage and start I'm a big guy I can give a pretty hard spanking so they want to do that Proverbs 23 Proverbs 23 verse 13 the Bible says withhold not correction from the child for if thou beatest him with the rod he shall not die if you give a proper spanking with a what's it say to do it with the rod does it say your hand does it say a belt no it says with the rod and it says child okay thou shalt beat him with the rod thou shalt you see those first three words there in verse 14 thou shalt beat does that a commandment thou shalt beat him with the rod and shall deliver his soul from hell if you don't spank your children and you don't beat them with the rod then your your child would probably grow up and not think that any consequences exist and they will not get saved and a lot of times when you go to the door and someone says they've never been spanked they will not get saved in most in most instances sometimes they do but if they don't understand punishment they don't understand correction this this Proverbs here to help us understand that hey you're gonna deliver your child from hell if they understand consequences okay verse chapter 22 verse 15 and when I say beat I'm not saying a you know leave them in a bloody pulp in the in the corner or something obviously I'm not talking beat the but the Bible doesn't use the word spank okay he uses the word beat okay and beating doesn't have to mean what you obviously bring up in your mind about it Proverbs 22 15 says foolishness is bound in the heart of a child but the rod of correction shall drive it far from them so what again what does the Bible say to use the rod of correction doesn't say the hand doesn't say the belt it doesn't say anything else it says it's the rod of correction so it's important that we use the right tool for the job you don't use a ruler to take a pipe off underneath your sink you don't use a screwdriver to take off the piping you use a pipe wrench don't you you don't use you know a hammer to take the bolts off of your car I mean some people try but it doesn't really when you get mad you might do that but you know I'm just saying that the Bible tells us the implement to use that's what we should use so it says to beat them with the rod here's what AI said when I said what does the Bible say to do how about what does the Bible say about spanking your kids it says no direct reference to physical punishment the Bible does not explicitly condone or condemn physical punishment like spanking it doesn't condone it emphasis on instruction and correction verses like Ephesians 4 encourage parents to bring up your childhood in the training and instruction of the Lord suggesting a focus on teaching the guidance and guidance rather than solely physical discipline context matters interpretation of verses about discipline should consider the cultural context of the time as well as overall message of love and compassion within the Bible would you expect anything less I was basically saying you know in our current context of culture spanking you know dr. Spock in his book says banking is bad for children have I ever gone too far with the spanking sure I have have I ever spanked with my hand yes I have have I were spanked with a belt I have but I don't believe it's right to spank with the hands because I believe that the hand that loves them should not be something that they fear because when you walk up to your kid and you're just like you do this and then they do this then they're afraid of your hands and I don't want I you know I I don't I didn't like that I know I was seeing that for my kids I didn't like that so I decided to not hit them with my hands I'm not saying I never did even after that but I'm just saying you know because sometimes there's nothing handy except for the hand and I look I'm not I'm not saying it was okay I'm just saying that I just that's my that's my personal feeling on it and I'm not perfect so I'm not saying I never did it but yeah I don't I didn't want my children to flinch when my hand came near them so and you know I've spanked with the belt before but I spanked my kids one time with the belt and I felt really bad about it and because of verses like using the rod and I felt like if the Bible doesn't spell out to use it then I shouldn't eat her either so I apologize to my kids and promised them that I would never use the belt on them again and as God is my witness I never did I came close but you can ask any of my kids if I after I because they I'm sure they remember that day because I really laced into them but I felt bad about it and I just didn't think it was right because it's like where's the Bible say to use a belt on them it doesn't so now people would say well the chasing the scourging okay that's fine but a lot most of the verses that it talks about spanking your children it's talking about the rod it uses the rod like four or five times so I just preferred to use like a stick or like a spatula or something like that and that was what I used every time after that I never spanked them with the belt again so I'm not trying to make you feel bad if he did that or do that just saying what I believe Proverbs 13 24 says he that spareth his rod hateth his son but he that loveth him chasteneth him be times that means early so I believe that you should be age-appropriate obviously when they're first born and they're crying that's not the time to use discipline on your children they they're just hungry okay so age-appropriate obviously how many smacks one to three was my general my general formula five for you know a pretty bad one but then ten is the most I probably ever did on a major infraction and that was the most I ever used but generally speaking one to three and I can get a lot done with one to three I can get a pretty good one in so and if you use something that you know your your purpose is to sting with the spanking and you hit him in the tush behind her parts right not the back not the neck not the shoulders not the hands you know of course kids they always want to put their hands back there thinking that that's a good idea but it's like move your hands I said move your hands you know they move them real quick and after that but you know the the spankings of course if you do it be times as the years go on you're gonna have to spank them less and less if you don't spank them early on you're you're gonna you're looking for trouble you're like well what about teens I've heard these I've heard preaching lately where pastors are getting up and saying it's wrong to spank your teenagers you should not spank your teens that's complete garbage folks it is trash don't listen to that that's when they can get the most mouthy that's when they start flashing those defiant looks and look it should be very few and far between because you should have already chasing that out of them but when they flash that defiant like I feel like I'm gonna fight you look oh man that's when you got to take them and show them daddy still got it daddy will still beat yo you know what and the the daughter giving your wife the sass and flashing the rolling eyes and the defiance that's that's a spanking and that's a lot of teenagers turn weird I'm not I mean that I love them but there's a point where they just start they start becoming adults and then they start thinking you know thinking all these thoughts and their hormones are going crazy and they start wanting to be the boss it's like usually to get married and get out if you want to be the boss of this house you're gonna have to be the big daddy and I'm the big daddy at this house so you need to go be big daddy at your own home go get married so and it's like what you so you just need to stop whooping your kids at 12 years old it's like Oh 13 can't spank oh no that's not true that is not true and I will say this that I spanked all of my teenagers in their teenage years and of course it was very few and far in between but I still did it up until they left my house from time to time but again not and I don't really want to embarrass them but like it is true you can ask them I did and like well that's embarrassing pastor you should have never done that well my kids are all still in church my kids are all still serving the Lord and you know what I spanked male and female I'm an equal opportunity spanker I spanked him with the left I spanked him with the right you know I without exception without you know gender equal I I put gender equality in there all right when a teenage boy tries to flex up it's like I'm gonna show that boy who the man of the house is the teenage daughters roll in the eyes and given the defiance ass it's time to beat that kind of part so I'm not an over-the-top disciplinarian though my kids will tell you that but when the need arose to discipline any teenager in my house you better believe that I did and you better believe that you should and you're like well it just I don't know pastor that seems weird it might seem weird but you better do it because if you're just gonna let him steamroll you for 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 you know let them steamroll you for seven years you're a fool sorry but you're a fool well I was just chasing my son while there's hope is there still hope at 13 14 15 16 and 17 18 and 19 well there's still hope then still chasing them let not thy soul spare for his crying or for his pouting and when it says my son daughters are included in that just so you know people like well never says chasing your daughter in the Bible you're an idiot if that's what you think and yeah it does feel weird to spank a teenager because they're like almost as big as you are just make them lay down on their stomach and give them the swats it's not that really that difficult I mean I spanked me in one time when she was a teenager and she didn't talk to me for two weeks but she still submitted to the spanking didn't she she was mad at me but she still loves me she's in there smiling shaking her head but she still loves me and look what are non-negotiable spankings lying stealing obviously fornication blatant disobedience blatantly saying I'm not going to do something boom it's it's it's it's a no-brainer major sins but listen in wrath remember mercy you don't have to spank on every infraction okay God look God does punish sin but he also gives us mercy and grace and he doesn't beat us as bad as we deserve he doesn't just annihilate us every time we do something wrong so just remember that with your kids because how you are with your kids he might be with you as his kid and you don't want to be annihilated every time you do something because you annihilate your children every time they do something think about that all right so if you don't show grace then they won't also understand grace so we're to teach them like God teaches us so the main point I just wanted to drive home in this sermon though is that no matter if we raise our children perfect they still have free will and every situation could be different as the Garden of Eden and they can still rebel if they could rebel with God they can rebel against us and children don't rebel because children I'm sorry children don't rebel because it won't go well so that's it we're afraid well we thank you so much for the clear teachings of Scripture Lord I pray that you just help us to keep things within context keep things with what the Bible says Lord I pray that all the children here in our church that are raised by their parents will be saved I pray Lord that we would be the type of parents that children could look up to and Lord I pray the children here don't have some weird belief that their parents have to be perfect Lord parents fail to but Lord I pray that when our parents do fail that they own up to it they just tell their children that they're sorry and Lord sometimes we make mistakes and we do have to own it but also Lord I pray that the children when they make mistakes that they would own it to not be disgruntled and hate their parents in their heart and want to live some different way Lord I pray that you would just impress upon the young people in this church that they would realize that there's nothing that the world has to offer them that's better than what you have to offer Lord I pray that the children in our church would serve you with all their hearts minds soul and strength for all the days of their life and Lord that you would just help our parents here to just realize how important it is to raise their children in a good church to teach them the Bible and to teach them at home and train them in the ways of the Lord in Jesus name we pray amen page 343 revive us again page 343 on the first we praise thee O God for the son of thy love for Jesus who died and is now gone above hallelujah line the glory hallelujah amen hallelujah line the glory revive us again we praise thee O God for the spirit of life who has shown us our Savior and scattered our night hallelujah line the glory hallelujah amen hallelujah line the glory revive us again all glory and praise to the lamb that was slain who has borne all our sins and has cleansed every stain hallelujah line the glory hallelujah amen hallelujah line the glory revive us again on the last revive us again fill each heart with my love may so be rekindled with fire from above I'm the glory amen I'm the glory revive us again man we're so happy that you participated with the singing this morning and showed up we love to see you back here at 3 30 this afternoon for a second service brother Eli can you end us with the word of prayer