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Okay, so we're up to Romans chapter 9 now on our Sunday evening Bible study and it's a bit of a gear change now in this epistle to the Romans. Paul was explaining if you remember in the last chapter which we did I think a couple of weeks ago now about the Holy Spirit, the resurrection, the difference between being saved and unsaved and then he finished chapter 8 with a great few verses on eternal security. Then chapter 9 begins here with this where he says, I say the truth in Christ, I lie not, my conscience also bearing me witness in the Holy Ghost that I have great heaviness and continual sorrow in my heart. Let's go to the Lord and a word of prayer before we get started. Father, thank you for this great chapter of the Bible. Please help me to just preach it accurately now, boldly. Just fill me with your Spirit, please help those here just to stay awake now, to stay alert, to just hear what you've got to say to them through this chapter, through me, please just use me in the way that you want to use me so that people just get edified by this chapter as much as possible and please just help us all now to just be able to apply what we learned today going forward in our lives. In Jesus' name we pray all of this, Amen. Okay, so Paul's saying here that he's not making this up, this is a genuine sorrow. Okay, this is a genuine sorrow because I don't know about you but I've been around many so-called Christians that claim to have a genuine sorrow for the lost, that claim to have a genuine sorrow for certain people. I've been to many churches that claim to have a real, real sorrow for the lost, don't they? They have a real heart for the lost, they claim, yet they have such a heart for the lost, yet they seem to be unable to even go and try and preach a Gospel to the lost. They seem incapable of actually going out and doing anything without sorrow but they have such a heart for the lost. Such a heart for the lost that they throw some of their, you know, tithed money to some missionary who had a real heart for the lost out in the Maldives or some other tropical location because they've got such a heart for the lost, haven't they? It's always somewhere tropical, isn't it? Somewhere that's a real, real cool place to go, yeah? They never rarely seem to get a heart for the lost in Bognor or somewhere like that, do they? But they have a heart for the lost somewhere that's glamorous a lot of the time and it's not always somewhere glamorous. I mean I've been around people that claim to have a heart for the lost in the UK. I don't know any of you guys have probably met a few missionaries to the UK. Some of the churches here are so-called missionaries to the UK. Real heart for the lost, you know, real heart for the UK. Yet again, they seem incapable of going out soul winning. They seem incapable of actually preaching the Gospel to the lost in the UK. They got such a heart for the lost that they were willing to accept a fairly nice paycheck from their supporting churches and a fairly cushy lifestyle here but not enough heart to go and preach the actual Gospel here. But Paul here, he's not one of these, is he? Paul here is saying that he has a great heaviness and continual sorrow in his heart. For who? For what? Well, he says in verse three, for I could wish that myself were accursed from Christ for my brethren, my kinsmen according to the flesh, who are Israelites to whom pertaineth the adoption and the glory and the covenants and the giving of the law and the service of God and the promises, whose are the fathers and of whom as concerned in the flesh Christ came, who is over all God blessed for ever. Amen. So basically he has such a great heaviness and continual sorrow for his kinsmen, his countrymen and you know, there are different views on this. Is it necessarily a bad thing? Now, you can look at this and just say, oh, you know, what is he? Some sort of racist? What is he? Some sort of, you know, nationalist and everything else. But bear in mind when you look at this, up to this point, when you compare and don't get me wrong, yeah, there's a lot of wickedness that went on in Israel, but still these are people that at least had the word of God. Yeah, at least some of them were trying to live by the word of God. And there was a big difference between or there should have been a big difference between what was Old Testament Israel and all the gentile nations surrounding them. Yeah. So maybe that was part of it. I don't know, really. But Paul, he obviously has a big heart there for him because he's basically said here, he said in verse three, for I could wish that myself were accursed from Christ for my brethren, for my kinsmen according to the flesh. So he's basically saying that he would be prepared to be unsaved himself for their salvation, for all of them to have salvation. And anyone here would be willing to just swap their salvation for their nation, their people, their, I don't think many would, would they? I don't think many would. Turn back to Exodus 32, because this is reminiscent of Moses, isn't it? When you see this, the only other person, I think, if I'm right about this, where there's an example of this sort of attitude is Moses, back in Exodus chapter 32, where he's been up in Mount Sinai, where God has been writing the commandments on the tables of stone. And while he's up there, the children of Israel, if you remember, they get Aaron to make this golden calf, don't they? To worship instead, basically. So while he's up in Mount Sinai, he's kind of doing 40 days up there, and they're just going, right, let's make a new God. It's unbelievable, isn't it? And if you remember, he comes down, he smashes the tables of stone, doesn't he? Okay, Moses just flips out, he starts breaking these tables of stone, which would be written by God, and he had some anger there, because it's one thing, you know, breaking junk in your house when you're in a bad mood, it's another thing when you're breaking things which were written by the hand of God, yeah? You're literally breaking the most valuable things you can have there. He grinds the calf to powder, if you remember this, and he basically makes them drink it. Okay, so he makes them drink this golden calf, Moses just goes, he goes, pretty savage, isn't he on him? And understandable, really. Then he commands the Levites after them, after that, if you remember, to kill, and they end up killing 3,000 men as well. So he says, right, go out, kill every man, his neighbour, everything else, and they kill 3,000 men. And he goes on this rampage, but nevertheless, and look at verse 30, he has a bit of time to call off, and it came to pass on the morrow that Moses said unto the people, ye have sinned a great sin, and now I will go up unto the Lord, peradventure I shall make an atonement for your sin. So he still wants God to forgive them, doesn't he? Verse 31, and Moses returned unto the Lord and said, oh, this people have sinned a great sin, and have made them gods of gold, yet now if thou wilt forgive their sin, and if not, blot me, I pray thee, out of thy book which thou has written. So what's this book that he's talking about? What's he talking about? Is he suggesting that God behaves like the wicked Bible correctors, and just starts deleting bits he doesn't like? Is that what he's saying? That like the liberal lovey-dovey pastor who just blots out half the Bible when he preaches? Yeah, we'll just swerve all of that, swerve that, let's go back to love again this week, yeah? Like that, or the Zionist who just blots out the vast majority of the New Testament? Is he saying that sort of blotting out? Is it that book? No, he's referring to another book, isn't he? The Book of Life, yeah? The Book of Life. This isn't the Bible, in case anyone's wondering or been wondering about this, it's called the Book of Life. So Revelation, you don't have to turn it, but 20 verse 15, which talk about the final great white throwing judgement says, and whosoever was not found written in the Book of Life was cast into the lake of fire. So anyone not written in this book is going to end up in the lake of fire, okay? How'd you get written in it? Well, basically you're already in it, okay? It's a book of life. It's a book of life. Everyone that's ever lived was, or at least at some point, was in the Book of Life. So more to the point, how do you avoid your name getting rubbed out of the Book of Life? Because that's what it's saying here about blotting out. Well, there's two ways, aren't there? Verse 33, where you are, and the Lord said unto Moses, whosoever has sinned against me, him will I blot out of my book. So you could never sin against God. Anyone fancy that idea? Yeah, good luck with that. So you could never sin against God, that's way number one, that's the impossible way. Or you could turn over to Revelation 3, obviously sinning against, if you're sitting there going, oh but he did say, he did say, well him that sins against you, well Ecclesiastes 7.20 says, for there is not a just man upon earth that doeth good and sinneth not. Okay, so that way he's not going to work, but Revelation chapter 3 verse 5, Revelation 3.5 says, he that overcometh the same shall be clothed in white raiment, and I will not blot his name, blot out his name out of the book of life, but I will confess his name before my Father and before his angels. Okay, so you've got to overcome. How do we overcome? Well you have to turn to verse 1 John 5, 5 says, who is he that overcometh the world? But he that believeth that Jesus is the Son of God. Okay, and that's how you overcome by putting your faith in Jesus Christ, you believe on the Lord Jesus Christ. The way that you stop your name being blotted out of the book of life is by believing on the Lord Jesus Christ, and it's faith in Jesus Christ, isn't it? And nothing's ever changed there. Now Moses was willing to have his name removed and spend eternity in hell so that God would forgive his people. That's pretty amazing, isn't it? That's an amazing attitude to have, and that's a great attitude to have, isn't it, for a leader of people to love and care about him so much that he's even willing to go to hell, and I don't think anyone here could say the same, could they? Go back to Romans 9 though, where like we said, Paul is saying the same here. Paul is, I believe, well, borrowing the Lord Jesus Christ, the only other person that is willing to do that, aren't they? Is willing to do that, and it is reminiscent of the Lord Jesus Christ, isn't it? The Jesus Christ did go to hell for people. Well, Paul says here in verse 3, for I could wish that myself were a curse from Christ for my brethren, my kinsmen according to the flesh, who are Israelites, to whom pertaineth the adoption and the glory and the covenants and the giving of the law and the service of God and the promises, whose are the fathers and of whom as concerned the flesh of Christ came, who is overall God blessed forever. Amen. So basically, here in verse 4 and 5, he's saying, look, they were adopted as God's people, weren't they? They were a glorious nation. They had those covenants with God. They were given the law. They were serving God. They had great promises. They were the physical seed of Abraham, weren't they? Isaac and Jacob, obviously, as well. Jesus Christ's humanity was of that physical seed, yeah? Nevertheless, verse 6, not as though the word of God had taken none effect, for they are not all Israel which are of Israel. So he's saying, you can't just ignore the word of God and focus on endless genealogies, though, can you? Because they are not all Israel which are of Israel. Well, what's he saying here? Well, verse 7, neither because they are the seed of Abraham are they all children, but in Isaac shall thy seed be called. That is they which are the children of the flesh. These are not the children of God, but the children of the promise accounted for the seed. So according to Romans 9-7, being the seed of Abraham doesn't make you one of the children, yeah? Being the physical seed of Abraham doesn't make you one of the children. And this is where the race-obsessed Zionist, yeah, looks at this and says, yes, of course, because Abraham had two sons. He says, Ishmael and Isaac, and of course Ishmael is the father of the Arabs and Muslims, isn't he? Yeah, because he's got like that sort of sounding name, isn't he? So that's what it means, yeah, of course. Is that true, though? No, not according to the book of Galatians, turn to Galatians chapter 4. If only they could blot out the book of Galatians, eh? Oh, they would love to blot that one out, these Zionists, wouldn't they? And if you're wondering what I'm talking about, you're sitting there going, what's he on about Zionists? Well, basically, the vast majority, and I know I've mentioned this regularly, because we're going through the book of Romans, it comes up regularly, and it is a big heresy in Christianity, and many, many, many, many, most independent Baptist churches believe that basically there are these special chosen people that are somehow, you know, a couple of thousand years since, you know, since Christ down the line of inherited this kind of physical right to Israel, that they're God's chosen people, that in fact they're going to be automatically saved if they happen to be the ones that live in the end times, they're just going to get this automatic salvation, getting out of scripture that's being taken out of context. But is that the truth? Is that what the Bible says? No, because the Bible doesn't say that, does it? But it comes from false teaching, and as we know, the false teaching gets everywhere, doesn't it? And this is big, isn't it? You know, there's not many, I mean, you go to just, you go to other just false churches, you know, just blatant false denomination, they all believe some version of this, don't they? I mean, this is a big, big false doctrine. So let's have a look at Galatians chapter 4 and verse 21. It says, Tell me, ye that desire to be under the law, do ye not hear the law? For it is written that Abraham had two sons, the one by a bondmaid, the other by a free woman. Now the bondmaid is Hagar and a free woman, Sarah, okay? But he who was of the bondwoman was born after the flesh, but he of the free woman was by promise. So Ishmael was of Hagar, yes, Sarah's handmaid. Isaac was of Sarah, which was a promise when Abraham and Sarah were 190 years old respectively there. Okay, Genesis 17, 19, you'd have to turn there, it reads, And God said, Sarah thy wife shall bear thee a son indeed, and thou shalt call his name Isaac, and I will establish my covenant with him for an everlasting covenant and with his seed after him. Okay, so that's the promise there. Back to where you are, Galatians 4 verse 24, which things are an allegory for these are the two covenants, the one from the Mount Sinai, which gentereth to bondage, which is Hagar, that's just the Greek of Hagar there, and for this Hagar is Mount Sinai in Arabia, and answered to Jerusalem, which now is and is in bondage with her children. But Jerusalem, which is above, is free, which is a mother of us all. Now, an allegory is a picture, a representation of something, okay? So Hagar, or Hagar here it's saying, represents the old covenant, the physical nation which is in bondage to the law, okay? Sarah representing the heavenly Jerusalem, Verse 27, for it is written, Rejoice thou barren that bearers not, break forth and cry thou that travailest not, for the desolate have many more children than she which have an husband. Now we brethren, as Isaac was, are the children of promise. So this is Paul of the seed, I think of Benjamin wasn't he Paul, referring to himself and the Gentiles in Galatia as one, yeah? The children of promise, yeah? We, yeah? The children of promise, and these are Gentiles, Galatia, yeah? Verse 29, but as then he that was born after the flesh persecuted him that was born after the spirit, even so it is now. So in the same way that the older brother Ishmael persecuted Isaac, so did the physical Jews persecute the younger spiritual nation, the Christians, yeah? And that is throughout the New Testament, isn't it? In fact, it's not only throughout the New Testament, it's throughout the Old Testament as well, really, isn't it? But it's just constant, it's a persecution of basically from the physical seed on the spiritual seed. And throughout the New Testament, throughout the Book of Acts, and people come away, oh it's the Romans, no it's not. Throughout the Book of Acts, yeah, all you see is these Jews literally just stalking Paul, persecuting him and anyone connected and everything else. But unfortunately people don't seem to get that, and it's the same to this day, isn't it? Now obviously I would broaden that as well, I'm not saying it's only the Zionist Jews that are persecuting Christians, it's basically all the work salvationists everywhere, isn't it? It's just work salvationists everywhere that absolutely hate true believers, but especially, look, the Zionist Jews to this day, they sure as hell do, and if you, you know, if you've come away from all sorts of movies and literature and things like that thinking, wow, they really seem to just not like Christians, they really seem to just paint this picture of the crazy redneck Christian, the crazy Bible, it's the same old people, nothing's new under the sun, it's the same people. Turn over to 1 Thessalonians chapter 2 and verse 14, 1 Thessalonians chapter 2 and verse 14. And of course, again, you're not going to hear this preached sadly in most churches, are you? But is that because it's not true, or is it because they're just scared of preaching the truth, or because they've been brainwashed against the truth? Because here in 1 Thessalonians 2, 14, it says, For ye, brethren, became followers of the church of God, which in Judea are in Christ Jesus. For ye also have suffered like things of your own countrymen, even as they have of the Jews, who both killed the Lord Jesus and their own prophets, and have persecuted us, and they please not God, and are contrary to all men, forbidding us to speak to the Gentiles, that they might be saved to fill up their sins always, for the wrath is come upon them to the uttermost. Doesn't quite line up with the Jew worshiping Zionist mainstream Christianity out there, does that? Doesn't really line up to most preaching I've ever heard in churches around this nation, in independent fundamental Baptist churches here. Something a bit amiss there, isn't it? Ever heard those verses preached before? No, I haven't. Back to Galatians 4 verse 30 says, Galatians 4 30, Nevertheless, what saith the scripture? Cast out the bond woman and her son, for the son of the bond woman shall not be heir with the son of the free woman. See that? The son of the bond woman, Ishmael, the physical seed, born after the flesh, the Jew shall not be heir with the spiritual seed, is what it's saying there. So then, brethren, we are not the children of the bond woman but of the free. Now go back to Romans chapter 9. That's pretty clear there, isn't it? Pretty clear? Romans 9 and verse 8 says, That is, they which are the children of the flesh, these are not the children of God, but the children of the promise accounted for the seed. Now, by the way, they do have the ability to be the children of the promise, okay? You have to understand it, but Galatians 3 28 to 29 says, There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither bond nor free, there is neither male nor female, for you are all one in Christ Jesus. And if ye be Christ, then are ye Abraham seed and heirs, according to the promise. But the sad truth is, is that they actually, they basically called a curse upon them and their children, okay? These people, sadly, the vast, vast majority of them are not only not going to get saved but a lot of them are the actual opposite and they're given over to a reprobate mind, so many of them. And when you look into what's taught and you look into things that they believe about the Lord Jesus Christ, everything else, it, you know, they line up, don't they? They line up, they're, you know, they blaspheme the Holy Ghost, they're, look, they're contrary to all men, okay? And this isn't every single one, and look, it's not that we have a hatred for anyone that claims to be a Jew, because so many people who claim to be a Jew, well, just what they mean is, yeah, well, I think my mum was a Jew or something like that, they don't even know what they believe, yeah? It's not about a race, but it's about a religion, okay? Look, we still want to preach the gospel to everyone, okay? We love everyone, we want to preach the gospel to everyone, but I don't love reprobates, and if people are clearly just blaspheming the Holy Ghost, yeah, then I don't love them, I hate them, okay? And sadly there's a lot of those in the religion of Judaism, but there are many other religions as well. Okay, so where were we? Back in verse nine, for this is a word of promise, at this time will I come and Sarah shall have a son. And not only this, but when Rebekah also had conceived by one, even by our father Isaac, okay, and not only this by the way, let's have a quick look at that, because he's basically, there's another example at this point, yeah, that's what he's saying here, it's pretty clear that he's continuing the point, would you not say, yeah? He said, and not only this, because the Calvinists then want to take this part of the Bible, this part of this chapter, and then just rip it out of the context, yeah? They want to rip it out and then use some verses to basically teach something that's contrary to the whole Bible, and just use a little bit out of context, forget that it's not only this, it's still giving this allegory, and just start basically trying to teach their wicked heresies of Calvinism. Now again, if you're sitting there and you're thinking what's this guy talking about, what's he talking about these wicked heresies of Calvinism? Okay, as alongside Zionism, Zionism that has just perverted the vast majority of what is still real churches around Lev, there's also a doctrine called Calvinism, and I know I mentioned this briefly a couple of weeks ago in the Romans, basically there's this wicked guy called John Calvin, and he was just following up on other false wicked teachings that have been going on for years anyway, he kind of ordered them and collected them and got a bit of, got a bit of, what would you say, a bit of pace going with it, and people started buying into this stuff, and this guy, this wicked heretic John Calvin that people seem to think is great, I love to read books by John Calvin, a lot of the time more than they like to read the Bible, basically you could sum it all up in a nutshell where he believes that, and the rest of it is just clever sounding ways to back all this up, that basically the people here that are saved, you had no choice at all in your salvation, you had no say at all in your salvation, in fact God had pre-elected you from before the world began to get saved, he just kind of, with this kind of big finger over everyone just went you, no not you, but you, not you, but you, like this, and did this, and has continued to do this throughout history, so basically you have no say in it at all, yeah, no say at all, it's an irresistible grace, yeah, so you had no choice in it at all, you were just, God decided you were going to get saved, and basically what's the point in soul winning, because you're always going to get saved according to the Calvinist, yeah, funny that isn't it, because it's one of those false doctrines that does infect, save people, and I'll tell you what, because I got poisoned with it a little bit when I was first saved, it did make you think, well what's the point in going out and preaching the gospel then, if that's true, if that's true, what is the point, because people are automatically going to get saved, now this five points of Calvinism, we went through this briefly, but they have this this cute acronym which sounds so flowery, because it's called tulip, you know, what could be wrong with it, yeah, it's called tulip, yeah, I mean tulips are nice aren't they, okay, and it's basically, it's for their five points of Calvinism, and it's nonsense, so you've got your total depravity, that is that basically everyone is so totally depraved, yeah, anyone here feeling totally depraved, yeah, the Calvinist is totally depraved, okay, so apparently it's total depravity, so everyone is so depraved and so wicked that they could never even think about getting saved, okay, you've got the, is it unconditional election, isn't it, yeah, unconditional election is you, I always get mixed up with these to a limited atonement, okay, unconditional election, so that's basically, there are no conditions to it, so it's not that he chose you because you're good or anything else, but it does kind of, as a Calvinist, they must feel a bit like, yeah, I got chosen, yeah, I got chosen, no one else did, yeah, that was unconditional, okay, you were elect from, and it's a funny thing, because if you think about the word elect, yeah, elect is based on some criteria, isn't it, yeah, when you elect a president, it's based on him getting the most votes, yeah, when you elect someone to do something, it's basically from that word select, isn't it, you're choosing someone to do it, well apparently not in the Calvinist world, because in the Calvinist world, election is something that's done with absolutely no criteria at all, and it's just something that's chosen completely at random by God, and he just chooses you to get saved, but what does that really say, what does that say about everyone else, that he's choosing everyone else to be damned and go to hell forever, that's what the Calvinist believes, yeah, that's the flip side of the coin, so you've got unconditional election, you've got limited atonement, which basically is saying that the atonement is only limited to the elect, I think that's how that works out, irresistible grace, so like I said, you cannot, even if you decided, no, I don't want to get saved, it's irresistible, you are going to get saved anyway, yeah, even if you did not want to, if you chose not to, yeah, too late, no, irresistible grace, God already chose you, then you've got this other wicked part of the end called perseverance of the saints, then that basically is teaching that if you are saved, if you're really saved, you're going to persevere through the faith to the end, yeah, so again, it's just a kind of flip side of work salvation, because then you've got these people going, well, I must not be saved because I've stopped going to church, I must not be saved because I'm doing this, and what exactly is perseverance, how do you persevere, because it's not everyone here a sinner, yeah, every single person here is a sinner, and some people have struggles with other sins, some people have times when they're struggling more than other people, yes, they're absolutely ridiculous, all five points are a load of nonsense, but this five points of Calvinism, this Calvinism doctrine has infected churches all over the place, and I would hazard a guess that if you went to most, at least claiming to be bible believing churches around this town, I would probably say that, what, 90 percent are going to at least openly admit that they believe in at least some points of Calvinism, oh well, I'm not a hyper Calvinist, I really just kind of believe in some of Calvinism, or we like some of it, or we know we're open to them, what did I hear a pastor say to me once, that we're, I can't remember the word now, but he said something about basically, you know, we tolerate Calvinism, what do you mean you tolerate Calvinism, it's wicked, isn't it, it's a false doctrine, don't we hate every false way, yeah, because I hate every false way, and it is absolutely wicked, so where was I anyway, so point being, and not only this, because this part of, of Romans chapter 9 is then misused by the Calvinist, okay, verse 11, he says, well let's, let's look at verse 10 again, so he says, and not only this, but, but when Rebekah also had conceived by one, even by father Isaac, for the children being not yet born, neither having done any good or evil, that the purpose of God according to election might stand, not of works, but of him that calleth, it was said unto her, the elder shall serve the younger, as it is written, Jacob have I loved, but Esau have I hated, so look, like I said, yeah, electional firstly, Israel is a lecture, we, we become the lecture, that was God's name for that, it's got nothing to do with, with, you know, salvation from the beginning, we've just become what is that elect nation, as that spiritual nation, okay, so it's another allegory here, in Isaac and Rebekah's son Jacob and Esau, their two sons here, now the elder Esau serving the younger Jacob, but, but how did Esau serve Jacob, so if anyone's read, read the book of Genesis and they're looking back, oh yeah, yeah, so he must, well how did he really serve him, because in the early years, yeah, Jacob buys Esau's birthright for a bowl of soup basically, doesn't he, for it must have been quite a good casserole or whatever it was, but it was a bit strange, and that seems to be his inheritance there, and then he takes his father's blessing, but you never see Esau serving him, do you, I don't see that, when I, when I read through those, those chapters in Genesis, that's talking about Jacob and Esau, it's referring to nations, okay, it's referring to the nations, Jacob being the father of the Israelites and Esau being the father of the Edomites, now verse 13 there is quoting Malachi chapter one, which you turn there if you like, I'm going to do a bit of turning here, so he's quoting Malachi chapter one, Malachi is the last book of the Old Testament if you're wondering, just before Matthew, and from verse two, Malachi 1-2, it says, I have loved you, saith the Lord, yet ye say, wherein has thou loved us? Was not Esau Jacob's brother, saith the Lord, yet I have, yet I loved Jacob, and I hated Esau, and laid his mountains and his heritage waste for the dragons of the wilderness, now that didn't happen in Esau's lifetime, it's about the nation that he was the father of the Edomites, okay, it says in verse four, whereas Edom saith, we are impoverished, but we will return and build the desolate places, thus saith the Lord of hosts, they shall build, but I will throw down, and they shall call them the border of wickedness, and the people against whom the Lord of indignation forever, and your eyes shall see, and you shall say, the Lord will be magnified from the border of Israel, okay, so you can see there that that Edom and Esau being used interchangeably, I'm just going to go somewhere else to show you that again, turn to Jeremiah 49, which is more evidence of this, while you turn now, I'm going to read Genesis 25-23, where God is telling Rebecca about her twin babies Jacob and Esau, and the Lord said unto her, two nations are in thy womb, and two manner of people shall be separated from thy bowels, and the one people shall be stronger than the other, and the elder shall serve the younger, okay, they're even described at the beginning as two nations, yeah, and that's clearly what it's talking about here in Romans 9, in Jeremiah 49, from verse 7, we're going to see in a minute the name Edom, which is the nation, is used interchangeably with its founding father Esau, okay, and this is over a thousand years by the way after Esau the man was alive, and Jeremiah is prophesying about the future coming of the Babylonians, yeah, concerning Edom from verse 7 there, thus saith the Lord of hosts, his wisdom no more entombed, his counsel perish from the prudent, is their wisdom vanished, so he refers to them as Edom, flee ye, turn back, dwell deep, O inhabitants of Dedom, for I will bring the calamity of Esau upon him, the time that I will visit him, if great gatherers come to thee, would they not leave some gleaning grapes, if thieves by night they were destroyed till they have enough, but I have made Esau bare, I have uncovered his secret place, and he shall not be able to hide himself, his seed is spoiled, and his brethren and his neighbours, and he is not, so go back to Romans 9, but you can see there just another example of it, talk about the prophesying about that people, talk about Esau long after he died as a nation, okay, being used interchangeably with it known as being Edom, so back in Romans 9, these two nations are also being used as a picture of the physical nation Esau being usurped by the spiritual nation Jacob, okay, that's what the picture is, he's continuing this picture, and this is an amazing thing in the Bible isn't it, how real true events and true things that happen are used by God to give us a picture of something that he's going to do, a picture of something in the future, a picture of something that's going to come, it's absolutely amazing really when you look at it, think about all the prophecies of Christ and how things happen and incidents happen and things worked out to prophesy of things, it's just absolutely amazing, the way the Bible fits together is absolutely amazing the more you study it, he says here in verse 10 back in Romans 9, it says and not only this but when Rebecca also had conceived by one even by her father Isaac for the children being not yet born neither having done any good or evil that the purpose of God according to election might stand not a works but a thing that calleth, so God in his foreknowledge used them for his purpose of showing the coming replacement of physical Israel with spiritual Israel, it was said unto her the elder shall serve the younger as it is written Jacob have I loved but Esau have I hated, now Paul has it suddenly in the middle of trying to explain about basically the spiritual nation of Israel taking over from the physical nation of Israel, he hasn't suddenly here just gone into some Calvinistic doctrine where God just chooses to damn the majority of people to hell and they have no choice about it okay, he hasn't, right I'm just going to slip in here that by the way you know all those verses say whosoever yeah it said God so loved the world yeah and it said whosoever believe it in him all those verses yeah verse after verse after verse about whosoever you know about taking of the water of life and everything else no no no forget all of that because actually no um that you know I'm just using those words just for fun but really I choose I chose from the beginning of the world yeah there's no you know you know when when he said you know that God is not willing that any should perish but that all should come to repentance he didn't actually mean all yeah he didn't mean any he didn't mean all really because in fact just in the middle of this context about Israel I'm going to shove in some you know this something for the Calvinist to grab hold of and and sing and shout about what a load of nonsense isn't it but that's what that's what full stop treating is it's always things taken out of context isn't it so he's talking about nations and yes God hated the Edomites and don't miss the connotation here because you can go through this trying to just talk about the nonsense that's Calvinism and miss the connotation Esau represents the physical unsafe doesn't he the Christ rejecting work salvation Israel God hates him yeah God hates him that's what it's that's what it's basically alluding here God hate it doesn't just oh well yeah no he gets no he hates him he hates him like he hated Esau that's why in Revelation you'd have to turn there three nine God said through John behold I'll make them of the synagogue of Satan which say their Jews are not but do lie behold I'll make them to come and worship before thy feet and to know that I have loved thee talking to the saved yeah to come and worship well that's them serving isn't it that's the elder serving the younger there isn't it and there are many many other pictures of that I think throughout the bible verse 14 back where you where you were what shall we say then is there unrighteousness with God God forbid for he said to Moses I will have mercy on whom I'll have mercy and I will have compassion whom I will have compassion so then it is not of him that willeth nor of him that runneth but of God that showeth mercy for the scripture saith under Pharaoh even for this same purpose have I raise thee up that I might show my power in thee and that my name might be declared throughout all the earth therefore have the mercy on whom he will have mercy and whom he will he hardeneth so the question verse 14 there is there unrighteousness with God of course not it's it's a question that he's saying that some might ask yeah that maybe some idiots have asked yeah is it fair for him to have mercy upon the gentiles is it fair for him to use wicked nations as a picture of future events you could say is it fair for him to raise up wicked rulers like Pharaoh for his own purpose and ultimately he can have mercy and he can also harden people but it's not for no reason is it Romans 1 makes it clear why people are given over to a reprobate mind doesn't it yeah it makes it clear if you're unsure about this go back watch my sermon on Romans 1 and and or just read through Romans 1 okay you don't even have to watch a sermon it's not I don't I think it's really hard doctrine is it I mean you read Romans 1 it's clear as day why God people why God gives people over to a reprobate mind it's them that rejected him it's them that changed the truth of God into a lie in the same way it was Pharaoh that kept holding his own heart then God hardened his heart they do it first verse 19 says thou will say then unto me why did he yet find fault for who hath resisted his will neighbor o man who art thou that applies against God shall the thing formed say to him that formed it why has thou made me thus so first off anyway who are we to question God yeah who are we to question God yeah but people do don't they people do question him a lot it's not that they don't believe the word of God it's that they want a God of their own making don't they that's what we see all the time that's what we see when we're out preaching that's what you see when you talk to people it it's not that well you know I don't really believe what the bible says it's basically I just want to make my own God yeah I want to take bits I want to have this bit and not that bit I want to take this truth and not that truth I like the idea of God in heaven but I think I'll forget the hell bit yeah we'll keep hell for just like the people that are a thousand times more wicked than me but everyone else family friends you know they're all right you know and and people want to make their own God don't they but here where we were and and you know where he's talking about therefore have the mercy on whom he will have mercy and whom he will he hardeneth back in verse 18 there and he gives the example of pharaoh and others look don't forget that we that we're in the context here of the book of Romans where he's been making it clear earlier on in there in in Romans 2 we looked at this as well that look the vast vast majority of though a lot maybe not I don't want to say the vast majority but a lot of those Jews are basically hardened and given over aren't they okay he made that clear in Romans chapter 2 you know when we looked at that he was using all he was he was referring to descriptions of reprobates talking about the Jews and that's what the context he's giving here and saying well well is that okay is that fair well look at the end of the day they reject yeah it's down to them and what they do and the same way people because the Calvinists will look at it and go look see so he just he he made pharaoh a reprobate no pharaoh made himself a reprobate okay pharaoh at least he made the choices which resulted in God making him a reprobate and look God didn't go right pharaoh's going to be a reprobate no what what God did do is he lifted up someone that was going to be a reprobate to make an example of him okay and God will do that God will use people for his purpose okay but ultimately they still make their choices in life look at verse 21 it says have not the power the potter power over the clay of the same lump to make one vessel unto honor another one to dishonor what if God willing to show his wrath and to make his power known endured with much long suffering the vessels of wrath fitted to destruction now I've heard this preached in many different ways and look I believe he's saying this that how about instead of thinking those poor old reprobates those poor old Jews here is the context here you know that poor old physical nation that had been given over to a reprobate mine how about think that God endured he put up with these wicked people much longer than he had to to use them for our own good because look he even though it's saying he even though he could show his wrath make his power known basically he endures these wicked people doesn't he he endures these wicked people because I believe that's one of the purposes of the reprobate isn't it okay that's the reason they're still even here they're still alive you know they show us the folly of rejecting God don't they for one really you should look at some just flaming sodomite yeah you should look those people that are just the the most open vilest just blatant sodomites you should just look at those people and go man I would not want to I would not want to reject God yeah you should look as an unsaved you should look as a parent and and and point them at your kid and go you don't want to end up like that you want to make sure you get safe you want to be telling people you want to be saying to everyone make sure you get saved because at that yeah that is disgusting isn't it yeah that's how we should look at it we should look at it and go that is absolutely sick that is twisted that is beyond anything and that's how we should look at the reprobate shouldn't we and obviously the world is trying to change that but we don't have to change do we we don't have to change with the world we should stay with what the word of God says they should the valsal much should have pulled people into seeking God that's what they should do because these people who are openly a lot of the time just openly just hate hating God they should they should make people want to seek the truth shouldn't they Pharaoh didn't he he he showed the stubborn inability to obey God so you look at someone like Pharaoh who's just clearly just rejecting and rejecting and rejecting God and it should be like wow you don't want to do that do you and he was he was used as a great example of that wasn't he for then God to show his power but but in the same way what about like the atheist the reprobate atheist it will just not accept that there's a creator I mean it should just be ridiculous shouldn't it when you see someone who's literally just back you know just just going to the most ridiculous extremes of trying to disprove something that is just probably just one one like rule one of just life isn't it someone made this yeah it just goes it's so it's so stupid isn't it it's so ridiculous that someone should look at that and just go we don't want to be given over to a rep my mind because look at the nonsense that comes out of their mouth you're not looking at going wow what a clever guy you know what what an intellect with you know all that scientific jargon oh yeah I don't know really it should just be wow look that's someone who was by the world standards intelligent and he he is such a reprobate that he's looking outside looking at each other and going yeah big bang yeah just came out of nowhere yeah just yeah it's it's it's that's what it should do shouldn't it should just make you go wow I wouldn't want to be given over to that rep my mind you start dreaming up all sorts of nonsense the full spot the false prophet who just rejects the bible and lies through his teeth yeah when you hear that when you when you see someone who's just clearly because sometimes you talk to these people don't you and you're showing them from the bible you're going look whosoever believeth in him should not perish but have eternal life yeah yeah still got to do something you know no no and especially when they're like completely gone and they're just trying to preach it and trying again you should look at that and go wow like they're just they're gone they can't even see it you're showing clearly the word of god by grace you say through faith and they're not of yourselves it's a gift of god not of works there's so much most got to work got to work you know got to do something again it should make you just go wow yeah that's giving being given over isn't that isn't that unbelievable because it is I believe that they should they should and probably still do don't they lead people to the truth I know we talked about this before that many um I'd imagine many people here just the sheer wickedness in the world understanding and getting an idea of how wicked and sick and twisted things really are that go on you know behind closed doors and sometimes not even behind closed doors sometimes in weird sort of meetings of all sorts of power hungry sickos and everything else a lot of a lot of people here got led to the truth by that a lot of people here were were wow you know they started seeking the truth didn't they because that's what these wild people do you when you realize there's a devil when you realize there's pure wickedness and you a lot of the time you might look for good yeah yeah well it says here in verse 23 and that he might make known the riches of his glory on the vessels of mercy which he had before prepared unto glory even us whom he hath called not of the jews only but also of the gentiles so that we're prepared unto that glorious resurrection yeah okay how how were we called well you don't have to turn there but second thessalonians 2 14 says where until he called you by our gospel to the obtaining of the glory of our lord jesus christ so we're all called by the gospel aren't we everyone is called but sadly most either don't hear the call or won't hear the call that's what it comes down in because look again you could go too far with this and go yeah everyone's called everyone look we still have to go out and preach the gospel don't we okay there are christ look there's a combination of christians failing yeah people still reject yeah people if they really saw but there are people that you'll go out to they weren't seeking you still get them saved yeah aren't there aren't they it's not like everyone you're knocking the doors i was just thinking about it's great when you have that you're just thinking here we go yeah i was just thinking about heaven this morning and you're thinking got one here this is a good one but you don't always have that and sometimes you have people are just like yeah okay and then at some point when they start hearing the word of god you see the eyes go and you see it's not always like that obviously you know you know sometimes they don't sometimes they shut the door halfway through or sometimes even worse someone comes down or or someone suddenly pulls them away at the last minute but but look it's not that everyone's sick we still have a responsibility don't we we still have a responsibility to go out and preach that gospel but he does call us through the gospel where until he called you by our gospel to the obtaining of the glory of our lord jesus christ back to where we are in verse 25 as he saith also in oc this is hosiah i will call them my people which were not my people and her beloved which was not beloved and it shall come to pass that in the place where it was said unto them you are not my people there shall they be called the children of the living god so we're still talking about the same thing here aren't we and we're still talking about that that basically that replacement yeah it's called replacement theology that's what many people call it and that's what it is okay it's clear as day in the bible he's quoting the prophet hosiah here talking of the gentiles being called the children of the living god yeah clear as day verse 27 is also crieth concerning israel though the number of the children of israel bears the sand of the sea a remnant shall be saved and what makes the remnant saved well romans 11 5 says even so then at this present time also there's a remnant according to the election of grace grace how do they obtain the election of grace for by grace are you saved through faith and it's faith and it all comes back to faith for he will finish the work and cut it short in righteousness because a short work will the lord make upon the earth and as aziah said before except the lord of sabaoth had left us a seed we had been as sodoma and been made like unto gomorrah so meaning that without that remnant yeah they would have been wiped out just like those wicked cities yeah fire and brimstone from heaven absolutely pulverized and again if you're wondering what's this this is sodom and gomorrah and and the bible is clear what was going on there it was sodomy as we know um and that's where the word comes from doesn't it from from that from that town or city what would you call it a city sodom and god this is what god thinks of of that wicked vile act and when it got to that point where it was out of control think of probably towns like brighton and you know san francisco and places like this i could think of probably some place tel-a-tel Aviv is a good one for that yeah tel Aviv yeah that that basically they get wiped out yeah fire and brimstone rained down absolutely leveled never to be inhabited ever again amen but i think no mistake about it there because israel became a wicked place too like you just said tel Aviv tel Aviv the capital of queerness isn't it yeah absolutely vile vile place and again like we said because it's one of the one of the characteristics of of reprobate isn't it now that seed that remnant can prevent somewhere basically receiving the judgment of god yeah that's what it's saying here if it hadn't been for that remnant except the lord of saba earth had left us to see we have been acid over and being made like unto gomorrah so go back to genesis 18. oh well i really like this passage where abraham is bartering with god to save sodom and gomorrah based on whether there's a remnant there so genesis chapter 18 and verse 23 so this is so god's about to punish you know sodom and gomorrah he's about to just just destroy them and abraham has his his you know his his nephew lot there doesn't he and he's a bit worried now and abraham drew near and said wilt thou also destroy the righteous with the wicked okay so lot saved we see this later you know just lot okay lot wasn't a just man he was justified through faith okay so he said wilt thou also destroy the righteous of the wicked pair adventure there be 50 righteous within the city wilt thou also destroy and not spare the place for the 50 righteous that are therein that be far from thee to do after this manner to slay the righteous of the wicked and that the righteous should be as a wicked that be far from thee shall not the judge of all the earth do right okay so he's basically saying to him look like you're about to destroy but what if there's 50 righteous people there what if there's 50 saved people in sodom yeah would you still destroy it are you still going to destroy it so what does he say the lord said if i find in sodom 50 righteous within the city then i will spare all the place for their sakes so god is willing to spare such a disgusting place as sodom if there were 50 saved people there okay keep that in mind yeah and abraham answered and said behold now i've taken upon me to speak unto the lord which have but dust and ashes so he's like saying i'm sorry i'm going to ask you again now something else pair adventure there shall lack five of the 50 righteous he's thinking i don't know if a lot's been soul winning that much yeah yeah let's hope maybe okay maybe let's go with 45 yeah he says won't that destroy the city for lack of five and he said if i find there 40 and five i will not destroy it so god's going to go 45 i find 45 there i won't destroy it and he's may come to him yet again and said pair adventure there shall be 40 found there this is some some good bartering isn't it he's just saying where you know what god's going to put up with he said i will not do it for 40 sake and he said i'll let not the lord be angry and i will speak by the way notice how he's talking to the lord here okay he's got some respect isn't he yeah good thing to remember when we speak to the lord isn't it yeah he said he said oh let not the lord be angry and i will speak pair adventure there shall 30 be found there and he said i will not do it if i find 30 there and he said behold now i've taken upon me to speak unto the lord pair adventure there shall be 20 found there and he said i will not strike for 20 sake and he said oh let not the lord be angry and i'll speak yet but this one's pair adventure 10 shall be found there and he said i will not destroy it for 10s sake and the lord went his way as soon as he had left communing with abraham and abraham returned unto his place abraham's thinking man i've done that come a lot must have saved 10 people yeah he's been there forever long uh but look i don't know what the equivalent is in the wicked nation that we live in because this is a wicked nation make no mistake about it this is a wicked nation i don't really know what the equivalent is here and and i don't know if look you know if it needs a thousand if it needs as opposed to 10 maybe 10 i don't know i don't know what the ratios are i don't think it's hard to get an estimate really of what the population of sodom i don't think it necessarily works exactly like that right there's a definite ratio of people to save that god's going to put up with i'll tell you what we can all probably do with doing a bit of praying couldn't we because look we live in a wicked place okay make no mistake about it and you're looking oh there's far more wicked place yeah i know i know really wicked place actually i know a wicked place called pakhet in thailand what happened to pakhet in thailand got wasted in the tsunami yeah and all those those wicked coastal places people were basically it was like sex tourism and the rest of it going on there they got wiped out yeah they got wiped out they got flooded god for me that was of god yeah and look okay why hasn't he done this place i don't know maybe there's some righteous another maybe there were no righteous people in pakhet there's only one righteous person there and he was like right that's it i'm dealing with it and we don't know exactly the reason why he will and why he won't i'll tell you what god's just isn't he so i'm righteousness with god god forbid yeah and look here we want to make sure we're going to up those righteous look i don't think i'm talking to a room of salt winners here yeah but look it's a good good to spell you on with that isn't it as well make sure that we're just upping the amount of safe people here to make sure that god doesn't end up with some sort of righteous judgment on this nation and that should be a good thing to spell on people everywhere as well shouldn't it because he'd be perfectly justified when they're wiping out this place because there's wickedness everywhere you go isn't there i'll go and work in central london what is it about london i mean it's like it's like being in britain now it's disgusting and they're literally walking down the side of the street holding hands and stuff now just playing out in and worse and much worse yeah there's blatant transsexuals everywhere the rest of it just in plain sight middle of the day walking down the road no one even backside let's see because you're sitting in traffic a lot in london aren't you so i find it interesting to know to try and look to see well what are other people's reaction because i'm sitting there going oh it's like you know it's just like you know trying and you look and then you glance around no one's even looking no one's even interested you know these guys are standing in the street you know you can imagine sometimes no one even cares no one even looks no one even gives it a second glance yeah carrying on my day you know let's look for a bird to wolf whistle out the window or something else the van driver you know in the old days they would have got it wouldn't they they would have got abuse wouldn't they wouldn't like not even that long ago i know when i when i was younger and when i was driving vans and i was young we would have abused those people you know out the window and it's tempting to now isn't it i know we don't you know i don't think that's really going to profit anyone but look nowadays it doesn't even seem like they get that at all what has this nation come to when they don't even get abused out of a van driver's window hey what are the van drivers come to in this world hey if you're a van you call yourself a van driver you know you're not that's what it's got to isn't it unbelievable but but we should be praying for most of you shouldn't we and we should be upping the amount of righteousness shouldn't we ourselves because it is a wicked place it is a wicked place look at verse 30 what shall we say then that the gentiles which followed not sorry back where we are in romans romans line what shall we say then that the gentiles which followed not after righteousness have attained to righteousness even the righteousness which is of faith but israel which followed after the law of righteousness have not attained the law of righteousness wherefore because they sought it not by faith but as it were by the works of the law for they stumbled at that stumbling stone what's the stumbling stone faith alone in christ alone that's ultimately it isn't it that's the stumbling they stumble and how many people stumble at that how many people stumble at faith alone they just cannot do it they cannot get their head around it they cannot accept it and that's and that was the same with with israel that was the same with that physical seed wasn't it that they just could not accept that it was faith alone as it is written behold i lay in sion a stumbling stone a rock of offense and whosoever believeth on him shall not be ashamed now the him here obviously being jesus christ yeah okay that's clear isn't it um he says here behold i lay inside a stumbling sign of rock of offense and whosoever believeth on him shall not be ashamed yeah and we could cross reference that the most obvious one just john 3 16 whosoever believeth in him shall not perish but have everlasting life but turn to isiah 8 13 because it just is a little finish here i just find this quite interesting so he said here verse 33 is it is written behold i learned sign a stumbling stone and rock of offense and whosoever believeth on him okay that's a stumbling stone and rock of offense shall not be ashamed isiah 8 13 says sanctify isiah 8 13 sanctify the lord of hosts himself yeah one of the one of the many names for god and let him be your fear and let him be your dread and he the lord of hosts that is shall be for a sanctuary but for a stone of stumbling and for a rock of offense yeah to both the house of israel for again and for a snare to the inhabitants of jerusalem and many among them shall stumble and fall and be broken and be snared and be taken so in isiah 8 13 it's the lord of hosts who's a stone of stumbling a rock of offense lovely lovely just nice example there that jesus is god in the flesh yeah it's the one of many and just just a nice one that you don't always maybe go to and can you make it clear here isn't he that whosoever believeth on him shall not be ashamed and just just as a last point on this chapter as well because like i said the calvinists love going here and just taking out a bit of it and trying to teach this you know that you're damn to damn to hell or your irresistible grace to heaven what does what does the chapter finish off with whosoever whosoever not who god elected no whosoever whosoever believeth on him shall not be ashamed it kind of makes you feel like he's just making a point for anyone that might try to take that out of context don't you think on that let's pray father thank you uh thank you for a great chapter of the bible um thank you for for you know the many truths that we got out of there and thank you that that you know just just that grace through faith that that we're able to to become your children we're able to become that spiritual israel and uh you know and to inherit all those blessings all those promises and what a great truth of the bible let let us not have that shaken let us not have that stolen away from us by wicked false teachers and and and all these wicked false prophets everywhere and those that have been sucked in by them just help us to stand on on your word stand on the truth and to you know stand on the truth that we are your people we are your chosen people we are those precious people those elect and and and it's not elect because of some some irresistible grace style salvation it's select because we have become what were the elect israel we are now that spiritual nation and we thank you for for those truths we we pray that you help us to just be aware that you know that there needs to be a remnant somewhere for for it to resist the you know your your judgment and obviously there is an ultimate judgment coming but but that's when the remnant will will be removed but before that you know lord that we we just keep trying to up that remnant in this in this nation and and in others as well help us not just to be insular with it as well as things start to you know as we grow now as a church we're able to start preaching other places other nations especially in europe and just help us to to just do many things for you lord from this church and we pray all of these things in jesus name amen