(Disclaimer: This transcript is auto-generated and may contain mistakes.)

. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . yay would zeal yay what revenge in all things you have approved yourselves to be clear in this matter so paul looks back on this situation and he says you as a church have approved yourselves to be clear what does that mean well can you really say that somebody showed true fear it has to be a time period right to know for sure that they're clear in this matter what paul's saying is hey a time went by the church got right with god and this person's at the church so obviously he got this sin out and there's a time that went by where they could reflect and say hey you know what you had this terrible situation but you know one year later we can look back and say this church got rid of the situation they're right with god they've approved themselves to be clear in this matter you could not know this if it had just taken place right if somebody was involved with his father's wife and he gets caught and he says oh i'm sorry it's like all right you know come to church tomorrow we forgive you that's ridiculous right you would have to have something to take place to know that there is true godly sorrow as the bible says because what godly sorrow is sorrow with a change look king psalms seems sorry right i'm sorry two weeks later whoops i did it again right just because somebody says they're sorry doesn't mean they are sorry so there has to be a time period that would go by now look this is not like two plus three equals five when it comes to church discipline there are different situations and it's not like okay this is three months this is 117 days look it's it's complicated you know what honestly usually you don't even know all the evidence so it makes it even more complicated and you do your best in situations but the bible does speak of this matter of church discipline and a key that's mentioned is well there has to be a real change so here's the thing if somebody gets kicked out and they don't get right they would never be welcome back because they have to get right first right somebody we kicked out a couple years ago in an email he sent me he's like well you know regardless of who's right you know just let me back at church is what he basically said it's like so you're saying you know that you're not admitting fault right it's like it's been over a year and you know in your email in your own words you're like well regardless of who was right in this matter it's like well that actually matters because the decisions already been made right but the other situation is this not only someone not allowed back until they get right the other situation could be a situation where you basically say they're never welcome back because it's just too grievous because you remember I talked about in the sermon series before about casting the whole body into hell and the bible says you know it's better for your hand to be cut off than your whole body to go into hell now there's a lot of things we can draw from that but one of the symbolism is we are the body of Christ you know what sometimes it's better to just cut off that hand get rid of them and say you know what you're not infecting the rest of our church body it's just not going to happen right you say well brother Stuckey that seems too harsh to me well let me ask you a question let's say for example you know you were a parent and you have a nine year old son and there's a neighbor kid that your son wants to play with but your neighbor kid who's 11 years old got you know in trouble for burning down a house torturing cats are you going to let your son play with your neighbor kid who's 11 years old got you know in trouble for burning down a house torturing cats are you going to let your son play with your neighbor kid who's 11 years old got you know in trouble for burning down a house torturing cats are you going to let your nine-year-old play with that 11 year old you're crazy right if you just let that you say what because it's too dangerous right it's too dangerous to your child you know sometimes someone might be determined to be too dangerous and we could never trust that person okay and here's the thing them that are without God judges so if we judge within and say you know what we looked at the situation too dangerous we're never dealing with this again too big of a risk you know what if they are a saved person that gets right with God God can judge them from the outside and they can serve God somewhere else you know you can serve God at another church right no look I believe this is the best church in the area but you know what you could go to another church if for whatever reason you know you're not gonna be able to go to this church or whatever you can go somewhere else and serve God okay but sometimes the church decides you know what this is too dangerous we're not going to deal with this okay turn to 1st Corinthians 5 1st Corinthians 5 1st Corinthians chapter 5 and let me explain something to you every church deal every church has situations the difference is some churches deal with situations some churches don't I mean just a couple days ago one of my friends who's a pastor he had somebody who came up to him who is I don't know how long he'd been going to the church but he told him man I struggled with sodomite pornography sodomite pornography from like the age of 8 to 23 and it's like whoa right now here's the thing you know what a lot of churches do oh well it's let's just not tell anybody about it right and so you can go to a church it's like man this church never has any problems no they just don't deal with any problems because churches will have problems that are gonna take place it's a question of are you willing to deal with it or do you want to do the Hillsong strategy of covering it up and keeping a good reputation look if you have problems deal with it what did my friend do he's like all right well I'm glad you told me let's come to the door all right it's like all right never come back okay it's like why because you know what sometimes it's too dangerous you got kids at that church it's like yeah you know someone who tells you man I'm really struggling with being addicted to sodomite pornography it's like okay this is not the church for you right notice what it says in 1st Corinthians 5 verse 11 now what happens if somebody gets kicked out of our church what should you do if you're a church member well the Bible teaches you should have no contact with that person 1st Corinthians 5 verse 11 but now I've written on you not to keep company if any man that has called a brother be a fornicator or covetous or an idolater or railer or a drunkard or an extortioner with such in one know not to eat the Bible says don't eat with that person and oftentimes you're fellowshipping over food you're eating together and the Bible says if somebody gets kicked out then have no fellowship with them don't eat with that person you say but brother Stuckey I think that the person who got kicked out was saved if any man that is called a brother it doesn't matter if they're saved that's not brought up here in 1st Corinthians 5 verse 11 it does not matter if they're saved or not they're called a brother whether they are a brother or not it's like if they got kicked out you don't eat with them but I think they're saved I think they love God well it doesn't matter if they're called a brother or not the Bible says with such in one know not to eat meaning you don't have any communication with that person now let me let me make this very clear you are welcome to do what you want because we're not a cult if you want to stay best friends with someone we kicked out that is up to you you're welcome to do that and you know what you won't get kicked out for doing that because that's not something you get kicked out for but you're in sin if you do that though because the Bible says when someone gets kicked out you're not supposed to have contact with them and look I've been at plenty of churches where I was not the leader and people got kicked out that I considered friends and guess what you know what I stopped having contact with them you say why well because I trust the pastor making the decision and it's like you get kicked out for something major not something small and it's like well you know what I hope that person gets right and comes back to church but if they don't it's like you know I'm sorry it's like I'll be friends with people that are at our church right the Bible says if somebody gets kicked out with such in one no not to eat it says in verse 12 for whatever I do for what have I to do to judge them also that are without do not you judge them that are within but then that are without God judges therefore put away from among yourselves that wicked person so the Bible says God judges those without the church outside of the church we judge those within the church okay and when a judgment is made the Bible says what's bound on earth is bound in heaven so basically you should abide by that decision now it's completely up to you whether you do or not but if you don't then according the Bible what you're doing is sin it's wrong go to Matthew 18 Matthew 18 and not only that let's say somebody gets kicked out and you think in your head well they're my friend and I think they're saved and everything if they are your friend and they get kicked out and you think they are saved and they are say let's say they are saved because you can get kicked out without being saved or with being saved without being saved right well here's the thing you know what's best for a person to get kicked out of our church to fall flat on their face and be humble that's what's best for them you are making it hard for them to be humbled if you stay in contact with them it's best for them to fall flat on their face and then they might wake up I mean haven't you heard the phrase of sometimes you just got to hit rock bottom and you know sometimes that's your wake-up call where it's like man what what am I doing I need to make changes you know many people that are addicted to alcohol and drugs they get over it when they hit rock bottom and get embarrassed and then all of a sudden they fix the situation I knew somebody in college here's a friend of mine in college he's a saved person but I lost touch with him a long time ago but here's someone who basically you know he drank sometimes in college and he basically got drunk and made a fool of himself and someone took a picture of him you know without his clothes on in a bathtub never drink again after that you say why so when you hit rock bottom sometimes you're like I'm never doing this again right sometimes it's best for people to hit rock bottom if somebody gets kicked out of our church and they are saved their best hope is the fact that they get humbled and they're like man you know I'm sorry I messed up give me another chance right and then they could get another chance if they're willing to humble themselves now the reality is when people get kicked out of church most likely they're never going to come back because most likely they're not going to humble themselves and and here's the thing if somebody wants to come back to our church that gets kicked out and they message me and ask for forgiveness you know if it was a sincere apology then you know what I would consider the situation and look at it depending on the situation but what I found is when they asked to come back their apology is not an apology it's like I vehemently deny this accusation it's like you know what this is this is like statement analysis 101 it's very easy to see through this right and look you can't be an idiot if you're the leader you got to actually look at situations and you know what people's words will actually manifest what's in their heart according to the Bible Matthew 18 verse 17 that's what it says and if he shall neglect to hear them tell it on to the church but if he neglect to hear the church let him be on to thee as an heathen man and a publican so if somebody gets kicked out of our church then we should treat them as a heathen man or a publican what does that mean well do you hang out with unsafe people all the time it's like oh I'm just gonna go to the bar to hang out with my unsafe friends well hopefully you don't right we're not supposed to hang out with unsafe people and yoke up with unsafe people what the Bible is saying is if somebody gets kicked out of our church whether they're called a believer whether they are a believer it doesn't matter you know what treat them as a heathen man and a publican meaning you just kind of cut them off from communication because you're not supposed to be hanging out with unsafe people all the time now by all means preach the gospel to unsafe people preach the gospel to acquaintances invite your co-worker out to lunch and preach the gospel but don't make that person your best friend that you're always hanging out with okay now turn in your Bible to 1st Corinthians 5 1st Corinthians chapter 5 as I quoted earlier what it says is whatsoever you shall bind on earth shall be bound in heaven and whatsoever you shall loose on earth shall be loosed in heaven so if a decision is made you know what as a church member you should stand by that decision and say we trust that decision if it's loosed on earth meaning we're saying okay I believe that person has honestly you know gotten right and there's a change we're gonna give them another chance well then you know what's loosed on earth is loosed in heaven and what the Bible is saying is God stands by the decisions that are made in this local church it doesn't mean that I always make the right decision because look these are not easy to make the right decision you know in a courtroom you got 12 people on a jury or whatever and an eight to four vote determines whether someone's innocent or guilty in situations like this I'm gathering evidence and then I'm making a decision and you know what yes it's not easy but you know what the Bible says God will actually stand by that decision okay whatsoever is bound on earth is bound in heaven whatsoever is loosed on earth is loosed in heaven and once again every church has situations the difference is some churches deal with those situations so look if you're seeing a church dealing with situations you should be glad saying okay obviously this is a church that is willing to deal with situations not having the reaction oh man I'm just gonna join you the Catholic Church you know I can't believe somebody got kicked out of church would you rather that we just let pedophiles stay at this church would you rather we just let anybody stay no matter what sin they're into right he should be happy that we actually deal with stuff so what is church discipline it's when somebody gets removed from church either permanently or temporarily well the other question is who has Church discipline practiced on them because that's what Church discipline is but does that mean I get to stand up here and say well I don't like so-and-so it's like man brother June beat me at arm wrestling it's like you're out here right does that mean I can just kick people out you know if I don't like them or if I'm mad at them or whatever no the Bible is actually clear about who to kick out of a church okay notice what it says in 1st Corinthians 5 verse 9 I wrote on you an epistle not to company with fornicators okay it's gonna list here a group of people that have committed certain sins okay and it says I wrote unto you an epistle not to keep company with fornicators yet not all together with the fornicators of this world or with the covetous or extortioners or with idolaters for then must he needs go out of the world so what he's saying is this I'm not telling you you can never be around someone as a fornicator or covetous or extortion or an idolater because then you'd have to leave the world he's saying you know what I'm telling you in the church setting not to company with these people but I'm not saying if there's a cashier at Robinson's that's an open homo that you can't shop at Robinson's right or if you know you go to wherever and then there's somebody guilty of a sin it's like you got to quit your job because you found out somebody committed fornication at your job well then you're gonna have to leave the world okay that's never gonna happen where you can just completely avoid these people but what it says is but now I've written on you not to keep company if any man that is called a brother so we're looking at someone who would be part of the church called a brother or sister in Christ be a fornicator or covetous or an idolater or a railer or a drunkard or an extortioner with such in one no not to eat so we're seeing specific sins that are mentioned here one of the things mentioned is covetous well how do you how do you find out if somebody's covetous if all they talk about is money money money money money money money that would be covetous and the Bible says that could actually be something so extreme somebody gets kicked out I don't think I've ever actually seen that take place at a church because that would have to be pretty extreme but the Bible is saying you know covetousness let's say somebody at our church was like always gambling or something like that like they didn't drink but they're always gambling at casinos or whatever well that that could become a major situation it would be something I would have to talk to that person about because you can't just commit all of these sins and then everybody at church finds out and then it teaches our young kids that it's okay to sin and do wrong that could be a major sin where it has to be dealt with another thing linked to money is extortioners now we think of extortion as violently taking away money from people for example you think of the bully on the playground it takes your lunch money right some kid is bigger than you at the school and he's like give me your money in your pockets and you give him the hundred pesos that you had for your lunch or whatever and you know what that'd be extortion because he's taking it by force oftentimes you'll see extortion when there's people that are in trouble with gambling debts and it's taken by force from them or whatever they threaten to harm their family but think about this logically do you really think we're gonna have a situation of the church bully like grabbing someone and threatening to give them a swirly or whatever if they don't give them the lunch money that's not gonna happen in a local church right it's not like somebody's gonna corner someone say give me your money or I'm gonna you know whatever punch you or whatever I doubt that's gonna happen at church but doesn't the Bible mention extortion as something that can happen at church so what's the application there's got to be an application right because if the application is just somebody who takes money by holding a gun to your head or a knife to you when is that gonna happen in a local church but you know what does happen in the local church people stealing money by their words by guilting you into giving them money anyway it's not just something that's happened at our church if you pay any attention to like-minded churches it's happening at churches all around the world that are good churches stealing money extorting money I would say we have a bigger problem here in the Philippines because people you know want to take advantage oh you know it's an American church plan or whatever we can get money or whatever but these things happen at other churches as well and then people try to guilt you into giving them money and people feel like obligated to help them or they feel like they're not a good Christian or whatever right that is what extortion is when you guilt money by force and really the the application in a church is by forcing with words one example give you is a friend of mine at an old church he was at the church and there's like four or five guys you know just kind of standing around talking after service and they're just talking about life you know how are your kids how's your job and this guy walks over he's like and so they all just kind of look at him like you know what's going on and then he's just like oh man he's like I'm just kind of worried what are you worried about right you know they have the awkward pause to kind of force you to ask you know what are you worried about like oh man he's like you know I'm worried about you know he had some medical thing like they say could be really serious and I need to get it checked out but you know it's pretty expensive I don't know if I'm gonna be able to go so basically he just went into a group of five people and just said I can't afford to go to a medical appointment and I'm in a really dangerous situation right now look you know what's the natural reaction well the natural reaction is that you want to try to help that person out because we tend to believe what people say I mean charity believe with all things it's actually a good thing when you give people the benefit of the doubt but that can definitely be taken too far when you deny reality and just let whatever happens you say well what ended up happening well you know my friend said you know talk to him privately he's like and then he wrote him a check he's like here you go go to your appointment right he's like you don't have pay me back it's fine just go to your appointment you know deal with this so you know the next week what happens well my friend goes to him and says hey how'd the appointment go oh man I got so busy I didn't have time to go into it and then he just kind of walked away and my friends just kind of standing there like never got the money back you know my friend did my friend forgave him isn't that what normally happens at church you forgive people for situations like this that but here's the problem let's say I find out about that and that person has done the same thing to like five different people and guess what that always is what takes place they do it to one person and then all of a sudden you know what they assume the person is going to forgive them and let them get away with it and then they'll go to another person and what takes place is generally we don't report this stuff because of the fact you want to forgive people want to give them a chance you say well they're my brother in Christ they're my sister in Christ now let me explain what the best thing to do would be in that situation the best thing would be to tell me about the situation because it could be that somebody else has a similar situation I don't believe you should gossip to other people at church but you know what when it comes to having a church leader you can trust them not to be gossiping information about various people at church so here's the thing let's say three people come to me with the same accusation well it's not just a coincidence now we see a pattern right and when you hear about one situation like that it's like when you see one cockroach you probably have more it's like you wake up in the morning and it's like you know yesterday we caught a mouse I'm like I don't know if that's good news or bad news because if we caught one mouse it means we have more than one right it's like one of those I'm glad we caught a mouse but that probably means we have three that got away right and it's just like if you hear about one situation it probably means there's a lot of situations like that because if somebody's gonna do that to one person they're gonna do it to a lot of people now here's the thing let's say that situation takes place and then it's reported to me and I find out about it and the person's really upset about they say man I need that money they owe me that money well that would be something where we would have a meeting and it's got to be settled and if they're not willing to give back the money or whatever and it's proven they would get kicked out of church okay notice what it says in Matthew 18 Matthew 18 I was told recently well you know at my old churches it's just like you know the pastor realized it wasn't his right to get involved in situations between church members okay then go to your old church then they if they're willing to welcome you back at this point go to your old church right because that's not how we handle things here we're gonna look at what the Bible says and handle things how the Bible actually says and you know what it's my job to protect the sheep of this church and when I see people taking advantage of you know what they're not getting away with it it's gonna be called out it's gonna be dealt with you say why because I understand how things work at church most people are very nice and want to forgive people and you what ends up taking place bad people take advantage of person after person after person after person after person if this takes place over and over and over and over again it's not going on forever and it might go on at Hell's Song Hillsong Hell's Song it's not going on at this church okay Matthew 18 verse 15 moreover thy brother shall trespass against thee go and tell him his fault between thee and him alone if he shall hear thee thou has gained thy brother now in this if he was not willing to forgive then he could go to that person one-on-one say hey you know you either need to go to the appointment or give me my money back and if the person you know I'm assuming that person probably would have lied about going to the appointment so he could yeah I went to the appointment you're right you know I was just busy last week I'll go today how did it go he'd probably just lie about it right I'm just saying that is how you would handle that situation and if the person's just unwilling to give the money then you know what that definitely has to come to me at this point and you know what once I hear about it that person's either gonna give the money back or he's gonna be removed you say why because of the fact you stole money from someone it's extortion and the person says no you're not welcome to that money right so the best way to handle these things is deal with it one-on-one if you can and you know what if the person's unwilling to get right or whatever you know you can always go and tell me or tell my wife about it so we're aware of it because it could be that with one person we have a pattern of a lot of different things that are taking place verse 16 but if you will not hear that you then take with you one or two more that in the mouth of two or three witnesses every word may be established so basically you try to deal with it one-on-one it doesn't happen and eventually it becomes more serious and it's like they're giving given kind of an ultimatum it's like you either pay up you fix the situation or you're done right that's what the Bible is teaching here so number one and let me say this when it comes to these situations let me be very clear these situations are not like a perfect science they're not easy to deal with this is not 2x plus 3 equals 7 this is 2x plus 9y plus 11z divided by the secant of you know why in this triangle equals whatever okay they're not easy to deal with because you have a million different possibilities the Bible gives us some chapters and sections to basically give us a template and then you try to apply that as best as you can to a situation but you know the good news is God says you know what whatever's bound on earth is bound in heaven right anyway the context of you know for where two and three are gathered together in my name is in the context of church discipline that's right there in Matthew 18 verse 20 right I think it's verse 20 let me go back to my notes for where two or three are gathered together in my name there am I in the midst of them right you go door to door sometimes and then you talk to people about hey you want to come to church we're having church right now like what do you mean we're having church well we're two or three are gathered together in my name there am I in the midst of them right it's like no that's not church okay but people the context of that verse though is actually with church discipline and what Jesus is saying is hey you know what when you're dealing with the situation I'm actually helping guiding you through that situation and what's bound on earth is bound in heaven that's what the Bible teaches okay now for some of you you might be hearing this and thinking I've never heard anything like this before but I'm giving you a lot of Bible I encourage you to read 1st Corinthians 5 in Matthew 18 when you go home today and see what the Bible actually says about it but I'm giving you a lot of Bible to show you exactly what the Bible says look church discipline is part of a church that's what the Bible says look if you've got a body isn't it true that sometimes you have a problem with one of your body parts right sometimes for example let's say you get an injury it's like oh man I need to you know rest my arm or ice it or whatever you know put ice on or heat or whatever or it's just like you know you got a problem you got a toothache okay well I need to quit eating sugar quit drinking pop you got to make some changes right and if there's a major problem with a body part sometimes they're kind of given the warning and sometimes the root canal happens okay sometimes like all right just quit the pop and then make these changes and if they're not all right the root canals happening you're gone right and so number one what is church discipline what's when someone gets removed from our church temporarily or permanently who has church discipline practiced on them well people that either commit a specific sin or they have a situation where they're not willing to get right with their fellow brother or sister in Christ now of course it mentions specific sins but there's a lot of sins it doesn't mention that would fit under this like it doesn't mention pedophilia well I think that's obviously given based on everything else in the Bible so I'm just saying it's it's a general template for example drunkard well you know being a drug addict is pretty similar to a drunkard I would liken them as the same personally now if somebody was addicted to smoking cigarettes they wouldn't get kicked out for that you say why I don't look at that as the same as being a drunkard I look at it as being a sin but not the same as being a drunkard now if somebody let's say drank one beer per week they would not get kicked out for that you say why that's not a drunkard that's someone who drinks alcohol from time to time right I mean there's no reason to take this pattern given in the Bible and try to make it more extreme than it is because what we're seeing is somebody gets kicked out for something extreme and you what you're kind of lessening the value of church discipline if people start getting kicked out because oh wow he got caught listening to kpop let's remove them okay it's like well I think it's wrong to listen to kpop but you're not gonna get kicked out for that because the Bible doesn't say you get kicked out for that okay when does church discipline happen to someone well it's when someone gets to the point where it's very extreme look at verse 21 this is right after it talks about church discipline then it says then came Peter to him and said Lord how off shall my brother sin against me and I forgive him till seven times so Peter's saying okay you've talked about the situation of your brother doing you wrong and Peter's like I'm really spiritual I'm willing to forgive seven times but what does it say in verse 22 Jesus saith on him I say not on to thee until seven times but until seventy times seven four hundred and ninety times so what Jesus is saying is we should be willing to forgive our fellow brother or sister in Christ but I would encourage you though it's important for you to let the church leadership know if it's something very serious because it could be something that's happening with a lot of different people and I might not be aware of that okay but the general thing is we should be willing to forgive our brother or sister in Christ especially if they've done wrong and they've gotten it right and said they're sorry and you know what if you're at this church for the next ten years you might have the same brother in Christ you know commit a sin against you you know three four or five times and it's like you need to be willing to forgive that person unless of course it's some criminal major sort of thing okay go to Revelation chapter 2 Revelation 2 you say brother sucky how do I know for sure if I should report it to you when they're begging you not to report it to me when they beg you notwithstanding I have a few things against thee because I suffers that woman Jezebel which call herself a prophet is to teach and to seduce my servants to commit fornication and to eat things sacrificed on to idols and so this talks about this woman who kind of gets the nickname I don't think this is her actual name but she's kind of nicknamed Jezebel you know just kind of a nice little nickname given to her Jezebel and it says she's seducing servants to commit fornication and eat things sacrificed on to idols well if these are things that are obviously pretty major now look we're obviously a Catholic country there's a lot of idolatry but Catholicism doesn't really teach you to eat things sacrificed on idols but let's say you're in a Buddhist or a Hindu country then you're seeing that sort of thing right and so imagine someone who's in church and then they're convincing you to eat things that are sacrificed on idols seducing people to commit fornication these are major sins but notice what it says in verse 21 and I gave her space to repent of her fornication space would mean there's a time period meaning basically they get a chance to get it right and she repented not so the Bible says is that this woman who's committing major sins actually got a time frame to get things right so here's the thing sometimes I might hear about a situation maybe you tell me about a situation but you know I might tell the person you know whatever and then basically they have a space to get things right now look if that sort of situation happens I'm looking at them like a hawk watching every single thing to kind of see whether or not they're willing to get things right or whether or not there's the same problems what I'm saying is don't be don't be quick to say man let's kick this person out for committing a sin you know they get space to repent of their fornication the Bible says I'll give you an example let's say we go soul winning and you get somebody saved here today and the guy you get saved is you know interested in going to church you know you don't have to stop and say okay well let's go to 1st Corinthians 5 to see if you're worthy to come to church how often do you drink alcohol because the Bible says drunkard here right are you living with your girlfriend you know I saw a woman back there see your wife is she your girlfriend cousin what's the situation that would be ridiculous right it's hard enough to get people to come to church just acting like a nice person imagine if you act like a maniac right so here's the thing if you get somebody saved and let's say you know for sure they're living in fornication maybe they're a co-worker you know what they are welcome to come to our church because how are they gonna make changes if this is all new to them and so here's the thing they would be welcome to come to our church and you know what if they started coming regularly and you started to know them as brother so-and-so they're called a brother sister so-and-so well then I might talk to that person quietly just show them what the Bible says and they would get a time frame to kind of make a decision right I'll give you an example of how this plays out in real life a long time ago in West Virginia I was you know going out soul-winning and there's these people that are you know kind of standing around and they gave him an invitation and you know I don't know if you've ever been like me that sometimes you invite someone to church and then right afterwards you're like okay I didn't realize this crowd was you know whatever they're getting drunk or whatever and all of a sudden people I invited church a bunch of drunk and everything one guy was you know a homo and everything it's like all right and then one of the persons he saw the invitation and he's like oh I used to go to this church and I'm just thinking because sometimes people say oh I've been to that church before and I'm thinking no you haven't right but this person told me he's like I've been to that church okay and then he said yeah he's like I got I got saved as a kid on the bus routes and so I I told this guy I say well I'll give you a ride to church on Sunday if you want and this guy was hanging out with some rough characters but he wasn't drinking himself and he wasn't the homo okay so I invited him to church and I was just thinking I doubt this person's gonna come called him up Sunday morning hey do you still want to come to church he's like yeah I'm dressed and ready to go I'm like well I guess we'll see what happens so you know I brought him to church and everything started talking to him and you know what he started coming to church regularly and this guy was saved he had gotten saved as a kid at that church and like 15 years had passed and everything so it turned out a couple months later I'm giving him a ride all the time I've got him on a Bible reading schedule he's reading the Bible every day and then all of a sudden you know I found out you know as I learned more about him that he's living with his girlfriend so my first reaction to that was well I talked to the pastor quietly about it and just said hey pastor just wanted to let you know this person you know that's coming to church it turns out he's in fornication he's living with his girlfriend he's not married how do you want me to deal with the situation and what the pastor said is okay he's like I want you and the assistant pastor to go to his house on Saturday and try to get his girlfriend saved I was like all right let's do it so we got his girlfriend saved on that Saturday right so that was what the pastor said and then his girlfriend started to come to church as well with him well months were going by though and it was reaching the point because I talked to the pastor again about it and I started to feel guilty about bringing him to church because I felt like man the situation is going on for a while but he's on a Bible reading schedule and he's starting first Corinthians reading through three to four chapters a day so I just thought okay he's gonna be reading first Corinthians five you know and this is someone that I was talking to following up with you know so I was the one who was closest to him at church and so then all of a sudden I just talked to him about it and I just showed him what the Bible says like man he's like you know I need to get married and I was like yeah that's what the Bible says and so I told him about that and everything and you know what I was positive he had told me that he had never been married and his girlfriend had never been married but his girlfriend was actually divorced which makes it a bit of a tricky situation and so it's kind of like okay well now this is very complicated right eventually the person kind of faded out of church you know because I told the pastor you know I'm really feeling uncomfortable bring him to church and you know he wasn't making the decision to get married or whatever and so basically someone else started giving him a ride to church and he eventually kind of faded out but what I'm trying to illustrate to you is this that you know what that person would be welcome to come to our church because if you meet somebody who's guilty of a sin they're allowed to come to our church they get a space to get things right you don't have to worry about if you get somebody saved but they're kind of a bit of a drunk or they kind of do drugs sometimes they're welcome to visit our church and you know what I will be long-suffering giving them a chance to get that right you say why well that's what the Bible says and and sometimes people want to take an overly extreme approach and it's more spiritual it's like well I would have kicked them out you know it's like well yeah maybe you would have but that's not what the Bible teaches Bible says you ought to be long-suffering with people now it would be different though if you've been at this church for five years and you're here soul-winning and you know everything the Bible says and then you're committing some major sin and just saying you know whatever that's completely different than somebody who just got saved that has never heard this type of preaching those are different situations okay so look being long-suffering when does a person get kicked out well they're gonna get a chance to get things right and you know I'll be long-suffering with them and let me say this the people that have been kicked out of our church before I talked to them about some of their problems before they were kicked out even months before where there was all these signs and all these problems and there was no changes never made with these people so it's not like brother Stuckey was too harsh no you just didn't know about all the problems that were being dealt with for a long time where it's like I'm being long-suffering but it gets to the point where it's like okay it's just too much okay now turn in your Bible to 1st Corinthians 5 1st Corinthians 5 so what is church discipline what's when someone gets removed from church either permanently or temporarily who has church discipline practiced on them people that commit major sins or they have a situation they're not willing to get right and you know what it's a major one so they they get told to leave because they're not willing to say they're sorry or get right number three when you practice church discipline well you're long-suffering in these situations okay and look here's the thing you say brother Stuckey I want to be a pastor one day and I might handle a situation differently than you did well that's fine because if you're the pastor of your own church you deal with it the best you can and you know what there are people that are like-minded that are you know less long-suffering with stuff like this and people that are more long-suffering I'm not saying that I'm perfect at this I'm not claiming that I claim to do the best I can with situations like these but I'm not claiming to be perfect at them because they're not easy to deal with it's very easy to look at somebody else and say well I would have done it differently it's like well you should just be happy you don't have to deal with all this stuff because these situations are not fun and they're not easy to deal with so number four where does this take place well it takes place in the church body it takes place in our church setting it says in 1st Corinthians 5 verse 12 for what have I do to do to judge them that are without do not you judge them that are within so we should judge the situations that happen within the church okay now in general I'm obviously gonna make this sort of judgment because you know I'm generally here but as I mentioned earlier let's say on a Wednesday night something extreme happens well if something extreme happens yeah you have to use common sense and logic and see what the Bible says and just say we're not gonna allow some major thing taking place right if two people came in here that are pedophiles that has to be dealt with and let me say this if I'm preaching a sermon and somebody comes in to protest or church or do something crazy you don't have to have me stop the sermon and go deal with it right now look of course this is something that's extreme and it's not something you would normally expect to happen but I've seen videos on YouTube of people like shouting at the pastor during the sermon or whatever and getting trying to get into a fight well I would appreciate if you just deal with that problem right if that sort of situation took place because it's not like it's gonna be easy for me to deal with that as I'm trying to preach a sermon okay for example let's say somebody starts speaking in tongues in the middle of the sermon it's like I'll probably mention something from the pulpit but it's just like you know what if someone could just deal with it have them quietly leave or whatever these things happen there's one time in Sacramento I invited this lady to church and then when she came to church I'm like oh man I wish I hadn't invited this person because she's like standing up and even when at the beginning she was on the side of Pastor Jimenez she stood up like that's right pastor and then like later on during the sermon she said like no that's not what the Bible teaches like what in the world and it's just like you know what it's hard to preach through situations like those it's hard when there's all of these distractions okay but we judge those that are within the church then it says in verse 13 but them that are without God judges therefore put away from among yourselves that wicked person now let me just say this if somebody has to get kicked out in the middle of a service something major whatever and let's say you're having them leave but don't throw them down the stairs head first into the wall or do something stupid just try to get them to leave as quietly as possible and that we avoid a lawsuit right if you beat somebody up on the way out of our church the church is not paying for your lawsuit I'm being dead serious right I mean I don't care if they are a homo if some homo gets kicked out and then you beat them up and then they sue it's just like well you're gonna have to pay for that right because I did not give you the approval to act like an idiot right it's like I understand some bad person might come in but you know what we're trying to avoid conflict the best is possible even if they're a bad person get them and you know what you would do is have multiple guys try to get them to leave as quietly as possible don't beat them up or do something stupid though and if you do you're on your own when it comes to the courtroom just is what it is now go to 1st Corinthians 5 look at verse 4 verse 4 you say brother Stuckey why do we do this though why do we have church discipline because people say you know brother Stuckey I just think it sounds too harsh because you know isn't church meant to be a hospital to cure people right I've heard people make this cute phrase before well church is meant to be a hospital to help the sick recover yeah but let me explain something called quarantining have you ever heard of that before maybe over the last year and a half in case you're not familiar with quarantining maybe it's something that might be on your mind sometimes they'll look at someone and say you know what we cannot have this person around other people because they're gonna spread this virus so yeah you know what hospitals are meant meant to cure people that are capable of being recovered but you know what sometimes they got to be quarantined either temporary or permanently okay and so why do we do this though well to protect the church body we want to protect the people that are at our church and part of that is we don't want these sins rubbing off onto other people if somebody's committing some major sin and we don't deal with it then you know what that's going to spread to other people at the church first Corinthians 5 verse 4 in the name of our Lord Jesus Christ when you are gathered together in my spirit with the power of our Lord Jesus Christ to deliver such and one unto Satan for the destruction of the flesh that the spirit may be saved in the day of the Lord Jesus and then it says this in verse 6 your glorying is not good know ye not that a little leaven leaveneth the whole lump now the Bible says in verse 6 a little leaven a little sin leavens the whole lump it destroys the entire body now I'll talk about verse 5 later on when it says that the spirit may be saved that's the spirit of the church and I'll prove that to you later on in the sermon but here's the thing a little leaven will destroy the whole lump and destroy the spirit of the church it will destroy God's blessing upon our church and so guess what if there's this sin that is not being dealt with then if it's not dealt with it's going to destroy the entire church right and look the truth is sometimes you know one rotten apple ruins the entire bunch right isn't that true you have a bag of fruit one of them gets rotten and then pretty much every single one is rotten sometimes that's the way it is or seven purge out there for the old leaven that you may be a new lump as you're unleavened for even Christ our Passover is sacrificed for us therefore let us keep the feast not with old leaven neither with the leaven of malice and wickedness but with the unleavened bread of sincerity and truth the Bible says sometimes you got to purge people out because they're a danger to the entire church body there are people that are in this society that are just a danger to other people you look at people that are psychopaths they're a danger to everybody right and if we have someone at our church that is a danger to other people it has to be dealt with or they could destroy the entire church body one thing is sin could spread but another thing go to John 10 John 10 is simply to protect the members from either financial or physical harm that could be done to them John chapter 10 John chapter 10 verse 10 the thief cometh not but for to steal and to kill and to destroy I am come that they might have life and that they might have it more abundantly I am the Good Shepherd the Good Shepherd giveth his life for the sheep but he that is in hireling and not the Shepherd who's owned the sheep are not see it the wolf coming and leave it the sheep and flee it and the wolf catches them and scatter at the sheep the hireling fleeth because he is in hireling and careth not for the sheep now look obviously Jesus is the Good Shepherd he's perfect and sinless God in the flesh I'm not comparing myself for other pastors to Jesus Christ what I'm saying is your job when you take care of a church is to protect the sheep take care of the sheep look after the sheep and what the Bible says is if you're a good shepherd you're going to take care of the sheep so when you see the wolf coming or you see it might be a wolf that's coming you know what you got to protect the sheep that's what the Bible says but see the one that doesn't care about you you know what they do they just use the Hillsong approach just kind of turn away and just say well just forgive them I don't want to deal with it right and look that's what most pastors do most pastors aren't good pastors they don't actually care about their members so they just let whatever happen and don't deal with it and let me be honest to you it would be a lot easier to use that approach it would be a lot easier to say well if there's any church problems you just deal with it one-on-one that way I don't have to deal with it that way I can just say hey I had nothing to do with it that's the easy thing to do it's not the right thing to do though go to 1st Corinthians 5 1st Corinthians 5 I wish I wish I could tell you that we never have anyone that try to take advantage of other people but that's just reality you say brother Stuckey I don't know I don't think this happens at most churches well have you ever heard of a guy named Judas Iscariot I think he's kind of a famous character in the Bible I guess Jesus was doing a bad job because Judas was part of the church is that what you're saying because last I checked he was perfect at his job right so look you're gonna have bad people that come into churches but you know any church you went to it doesn't matter if it's Baptist or not Baptist if you go to a church there's gonna be somebody who's not a good person at that church and whether they're a reprobate or not there's gonna be people that are trying to take advantage of other people this takes place anyway here's the truth a church is one of the big places this takes place you say why because people realize that people at church are too trusting too forgiving too honest they realize they can take advantage of you people are more likely to rip you off if you seem like a really nice person because they think they can rip you off that's the truth I mean let's just use common sense that's reality I mean a bad person doesn't care you know whether whatever you are they're willing to rip you off they don't care why because they know they can take advantage of you and so for one it's for the protection of the members it's for sins rubbing off but the other thing is the complete destruction of our church if we don't deal with situations like this 1st Corinthians 5 verse 5 to deliver such and one on to Satan for the destruction of the flesh that the spirit may be saved in the day of the Lord Jesus now as I said I believe this is referring to the spirit of the church and you say why do you say that we'll go to 2nd Corinthians 7 2nd Corinthians chapter 7 I mean I believe the person who is committing fornication with his father's wife I believe that person was already saved personally okay I don't think it's saying that well if you kick this person out of church he might end up getting saved well generally if you're kicking someone out of church they probably are saved or at least claiming to be saved if they're claiming to be saved they're not saved they're not going to end up getting saved because they're just a phony and if they are saved well they're already saved right of course there could be a situation you kick out someone who's not saved and not claiming to be saved but that'd be a pretty rare situation but here's the thing the Bible says if you have this sort of situation and you don't deal with it it's going to infect it's going to leaven the whole lump is going to be destroyed okay notice what it says in 2nd Corinthians 7 verse 8 for though I made you sorry with a letter I do not repent though I did repent for I perceive that the same epistle hath made you sorry though it were but for a season now I rejoice not that you were made sorry but that you sorry to repentance for you're made sorry after godly manner that you might receive damaged by us and nothing for godly sorrow work the repentance to salvation not to be repented of but the sorrow of the world worketh death now let me explain in these verses real quickly that he uses the plural when he addresses this church he says ye he says ye he says you which is plural always in the Bible now the bottom line is the main application is actually plural to the church but in verse 10 is giving you a direct statement that godly sorrow worketh repentance to salvation that can also be applied on an individual level how it cannot be applied is to an unsaved person getting saved because of the fact this is a church of people that are already saved so what he's saying is if this church has godly sorrow then guess what godly sorrow will spare this church from being judged by God the same thing is true on an individual level he's not really talking on an individual level but you could apply it that way okay that if you're saved and you're not right with God if you don't get that sin out of your life God's gonna judge you you know what can save you from that destruction well getting the sin out of your life right someone who's a drunk you you want to know the secret to saving your liver quit drinking saving your kidneys quit drinking living a long life quit drinking quit smoking quit doing drugs but that has nothing to do with getting to heaven okay verse 11 and he says this for behold the self same thing that ye sorrowed after godly so once again ye is plural what carefulness hath wrought in you you is always plural in the King James Bible yea what clearing of yourselves yea what indignation yea what fear yea what vehement desire yea what zeal yea what revenge in all things ye have approved yourselves to be clear in this matter because when you speak about a church you got one church but a church is made up of a body of believers right so here's the thing he's saying this church got right with God and they prove themselves to be clear in this matter because they got rid of the sin they made the change and they're no longer approving of this sin but here's the thing let's say they had worldly sorrow well the sorrow of the world worketh death it would have been the death to that church you say what do you mean by that what the very least the candlestick would be removed from that church doesn't the book of Revelation talk about having your candlestick removed if God's blessings not on you a candlestick can be removed where God's no longer blessing that church and there's a lot of Baptist churches that might be right on salvation but there it's basically like a zombie church it's like the living dead man or something where it's alive but not really okay because the church is destroyed now go to Joshua 7 real quickly I'll show you a couple more verses Joshua 7 let me prove to you that an entire congregation can be cursed because of the sin of one person and in this story in Joshua 7 you know Joshua is trying to figure out you know like what is going on you know we're getting destroyed why is God mad at us he doesn't understand and he goes to God and in Joshua chapter 7 Genesis Exodus Leviticus Numbers Deuteronomy Joshua Joshua 7 verse 10 and the Lord said unto Joshua get thee up wherefore lies thou thus upon thy face and God basically says to Joshua why why are you crying and say oh God you know he's like stand up then he says Israel hath sinned and they have also transgressed my covenant which I commanded them they have even taken of the accursed thing and have also stolen and dissembled also and they have put it even among their own stuff therefore the children of Israel could not stand before their enemies but turn their backs before their enemies because they were accursed neither will I be with you anymore except you destroy the cursed from among you what the Bible says is that the sin of this one man Achan is destroying the entire congregation if this situation happens in 2021 you've got a choice either side with the person causing the problems that needs to be kicked out and let the whole congregation be cursed or just get rid of the problem doesn't it make sense just to get rid of the problem and look if it's someone who's saved and they're willing to get right then maybe they can come back in a couple months if they're willing to get right and be sincere and you know what that does take place I've seen it take place at churches but it's not a common thing usually what happens is when someone kicks back they're never willing to humble themselves and honestly with most pastors I know usually when they kick somebody out they're being very long-suffering and they probably should have kicked them out before but they're just giving them plenty of chances and it's at that point that person is just not going to get right with God and they're basically done but here's the thing the entire congregation is going to be cursed if you don't deal with it so why do we even do church discipline to spare our congregation to spare the blessing upon our entire church that's what the Bible says go to 1st Corinthians 5 1st Corinthians 5 we'll look at just two more places real quickly 1st Corinthians chapter 5 so number one what is church discipline well it's when someone gets removed from church either temporarily or permanently number two who has church discipline practice on them people that commit major sins or they've done something really wrong to a brother in Christ and they're unwilling to get it right number three when do you practice church discipline well you do it after you know you give them a space to get whatever sin right unless unless it's known they're a pedophile or something majorly extreme where it's like okay that person's a reprobate or whatever but if it's something where they have a sin but you know you they're a safe person you believe they're a safe person they get a space to get it right and look well if that sort of situation took place where I'm not ready to kick somebody out I would be you know quiet and talk to that person individually and try to deal with the situation and if they're not willing to get it right it might go to another extreme to the point where hey it's just like you know what I'm giving you every chance and you know what these are not situations you like to have to deal with publicly but sometimes you know that's what it calls for right you know I've preached against somebody before and I still didn't mention all their sins when I preached against them but it's like you better get things right you're gonna be gone out of here right but you know that was done with being very long suffering with people and if people are gonna get kicked out of church you know what they get a space to repent of their fornication get things right you know and if they're not willing to make the change it's like well we're not having our whole church destroyed because of you right where do you do this will you do it inside the church body I'm not saying that you go to your boss tomorrow and say hey you know what so-and-so's a drunkard you got to kick him out right you got to you got to fire him it's like well then you'd have to go out of the world right you know when I worked at my job at Maryland you know I had business meetings where you know co-workers and bosses are drinking getting drunk I'm not in sin because I'm at a business meeting that I have to be in or whatever because then must he needs go out of the world I mean if you're capable of starting your own business and making lots of money well praise the Lord for that but you know what most of the time unfortunately if you work at a company there might be certain things where you know what you're in bad situations now if you're if somebody gives you a package and it's like all right here's this package you know what don't open it and I'll give you like 20,000 paces if you deliver it to this address well then that's the sort of situation you need a new job okay because you're probably dealing drugs okay but I'm saying if you're just work at an office and sometimes you know there's now obviously you shouldn't drink but if some are around you drinking and you can't do anything about it it is what it is right they had office parties on like holidays in Maryland and then they allowed people to drink on those days or whatever why didn't drink but I'm also not gonna just say okay well you know I'll just not work for today either because then you know you'd have that situation come up a lot so what the Bible saying is don't stress yourself out about stuff outside the church obviously don't hang out with unbelievers but it's not like you have to worry about that if you got a job or whatever okay where does this take place in the church body why do we do this to spare the entire church how do you do this though what's the method how do you determine when somebody gets kicked out well I want you to realize that sometimes you don't have to be present for those situations and have a meeting about it to figure it out because some people say well brother Stuckey if you ever have this situation you can't kick them out until you hear both sides of the story while we believe what the Bible says right first Corinthians 5 verse 3 notice what it says for I verily as absent in body but present in spirit have judged already as though I were or I were present concerning him that hath so done this deed you know what Paul says I don't need to hear his side of the story I already judged you say but how could he do that because it's commonly reported look if you're on trial for murder and ten people saw you doing it we got a video of you committing the murder right your your fingerprints are on the knife right there's a recorded phone call of you saying that you're gonna kill this person look we don't need to hear your side of the story it's like there's plenty of evidence okay and so here's the thing Paul says you know what in this specific situation I don't need to be there to find out about it just kick that person out you say well how could he say that because it's commonly reported he knows it's true writing there's no doubt unless you deny reality well how do you know for sure look if there's that many witnesses then they're not all lying is what the Bible saying so look this idea well they get a chance to defend themselves and everything like that not necessarily it depends on the situation go to Matthew 18 Matthew 18 now look if it's one person with an accusation against you then yeah you know what I'm gonna hear your side of the story figure out what happened see what evidence there is but when there's a lot of people that have the same story it's just like I'd be an idiot if I just said oh you know well I'll just give you another chance that's ridiculous right and I'll tell you what it is not easy to practice church discipline on people you might think it is like oh I would handle all these things perfectly you know what it is not fun it's not easy you know what you should honestly be thankful you're out of church that's willing to deal with these problems when they actually come up how do you do this well it could be that you're absent from the situation but you have enough witnesses that you know what you know it's true I mean we've had situations before you know going back over a year ago where people sent me a lot of text messages on situations it's like well when I've got a lot of text messages in their own words are basically admitting that they're guilty it's just kind of like that's a text message from them right it's like I can already tell I don't need to hear their side of the story about it if there's already a lot of evidence okay but sometimes you discuss situations notice what it says in Matthew 18 verse 15 moreover if thy brother shall trespass against thee go and tell him his fault between thee and him alone if he shall hear thee thou has gained thy brother but if you will not hear thee then take with thee one or two more that in the mouth of two or three witnesses every word may be established and if he if he shall neglect to hear them tell it on to the church but if he neglect to hear the church let him be unto thee as an heathen man and a publican and so you have a situation where somebody does somebody wrong and then you have a situation and then I step in and deal with the situation we have a meeting and look we have had meetings at this church for situations like this where I asked a couple people that were not involved in the situation can you be at the meeting because you know what you should get other opinions and find out you somebody who's not biased toward either side to figure out the situation and you what if you have this sort of meeting and you come to a decision and you tell people you must do this then I expect people to do what I say and here's here's I'm just trying to help you out in the future if you ever end up being at one of these meetings I will usually act very nice at that meeting when I say this must be done I guess people think I'm joking about it because I try to act like a nice person but it's like no I'm very strict about it and if you don't do it it's like okay well you're kicked out I told you you have to do this like what because they didn't think I was gonna actually kick them out right it's like no you must do this and if they don't abide by that then they're gone because you're obviously just not going to listen because if you were sincerely sorry about a situation and you got in trouble you know what you would just look I've had times before where I messed up on my job like I made a mistake with an Excel graph or whatever and it's just like you know the boss told me and he talked to me very sternly because you know I messed up on a project or whatever and it's like if you're honestly sincere then you know what you're gonna say I'm sorry I'll fix it I'll change it or whatever what if he told me to do something and then I just for example I'll give you a quick example we had this project where it was a big project we were doing for this company in Kansas and there's all these Excel graphs there was PowerPoint there was all these slides I mean day after day all I did was this project this project we had a lot of small meetings via video chat to discuss it in preparation for the meeting one week before I'm flying out with the boss to Kansas the person's like man this is great this is exactly what we need but one thing I forgot to mention is that a couple people on our board are colorblind I'm just like because the graphs were based on color I'm just like you got to be kidding me right and it's like I mean in my boss too was just like oh this is terrible of course the boss like can you fix this well what am I gonna say I'm like well yes I mean it's like all right I'm not an I I'm in I'm good at Excel I'm not that good at PowerPoint I'm like all right well we're gonna figure this out right and I'll tell you it took hours and hours and hours but I told the boss I'll stay as long as I need to right so I showed up early day after day that last week just spending hours and hours and hours and hours and it seems like an easy problem just remove the colors put a number well if you know how to do it it's easy if you and here's the thing when you're on a specialized project on Microsoft Excel you can't find the answer on YouTube if it's a basic thing sure you go to YouTube you just change the numbers or whatever very easy but you know what how do you type something like this in like it turns out someone on the board is colorblind how do I change this you know actually apparently nobody's dealt with that problem I guess I invented this solution you know it took a lot of time but what are you gonna do on that you just you just fix it you just listen to what the boss says the boss says you do this you do it right verse 18 barely I say in you whatsoever you shall bind on earth shall be bound in heaven and whatsoever you shall loose on earth shall be loosed in heaven that's speaking towards the decision being made if it's bound on earth it's bound in heaven if it's loosed on earth is loosed in heaven again I say unto you that if two of you shall agree on earth as touching anything that they shall ask it shall be done for them my father which is in heaven for two or three are gathered together in my name there am I in the midst of them and whenever we've had situations like this we have prayed about the situation at the meeting I've prayed about the situation I prayed personally my wife has prayed God helped guide us through the situation make the right decision but the bottom line is even if I make the wrong decision what's bound on earth is bound in heaven that's what the Bible says it honestly doesn't matter if you disagree with the decision I made God doesn't say well if you make the right decision it's bound in heaven that's not what he says he says you bind it on earth it's gonna be bound in heaven and it's just like of course we go by what the Bible says but you know what it's not like these situations are very easy to figure out and it's like God says you know what I will stand by the decision of that church and here's the thing then that are without God judges so let's say for example I make the wrong choice right so if you have multiple kids there have been times where your kids start fighting you didn't see it and you know what sometimes you spank the wrong child every parent has done that or they just never spanked their children right if you spank your children you've punished the wrong child before you look at the evidence and sometimes you make the wrong choice but here's the thing you know what you expect your kids to abide by whatever was was done though because you're still the mom you're still the dad right and look I might not make a perfect decision on something but it doesn't change the fact that we go by the authority what the Bible says and God says if it's bound on earth found heaven so let me just reiterate it's completely up to you if you want to hang out or fellowship with people that have been kicked out of our church that is your choice and you won't be kicked out of our church for that but let me be honest I'm not going to trust you I'm not an idiot I mean if you're staying in close contact with people that have been kicked out of our church I'm just thinking well I know there's somebody I can't trust you say why well because obviously you know you're not agreeing with what the church decided and look you're welcome to come to our church and I want you to come to our church I'm not saying you have to leave if you're staying friends with people that got kicked out I'm just being honest with you I'm not gonna trust you because of the fact well obviously you're not fully on board with what the church decided I'm not gonna deny reality I'm gonna look at the evidence and see the situation you won't get kicked out for it but I obviously I'm not gonna trust you either and you should just say you know what whether I agree or not with the decision I stand by the church I'm here with the church I stand by the church I support the church and the truth is when situations take place it is unlikely you know all the information so it would be kind of foolish to side against the church when you don't even know all the information you should just trust the church made the best decision and look we're two or three are in there God's in the midst of us so God is helping guiding through those situations so I would just assume if I'm out of church I believe God helped them make the right choice let's close in word prayer your heavenly Father thank you for allowing us to be here today and getting to see your word in this topic and obviously this is not the most pleasant topic but unfortunately this is a situation we will have to deal with time from time to time gotten we ask you to protect our church protect us from people that might come into our church or cause problems or whatever God but we ask you to continue help us grow as a church help us bring new people to church that love you and want to serve you and want to do right God and we ask you to continue to be with our church and help us make the right decisions on matters in Jesus name we pray amen in the song my Savior, first of all in number 46 in the song my Savior, first of all my Savior, first of all in number 46 in the song my Savior, first of all in number 46 in the song my Savior, first of all in number 46 in the song my Savior, first of all in number 46 in the song my Savior, first of all in number 46 in the song my Savior, first of all in number 46 in the song my Savior, first of all in number 46 in the song my Savior, first of all in number 46 in the song my Savior, first of all in number 46 in the song my Savior, first of all in number 46 in the song my Savior, first of all in number 46 in the song my Savior, first of all in number 46 in the song my Savior, first of all in number 46 in the song my Savior, first of all in number 46 in the song my Savior, first of all in number 46 in the song my Savior, first of all in number 46 in the song my Savior, first of all in number 46 in the song my Savior, first of all in number 46 in the song my Savior, first of all in number 46 in the song my Savior, first of all in number 46 in the song my Savior, first of all in number 46 in the song my Savior, first of all in number 46 in the song my Savior, first of all in number 46 in the song my Savior, first of all in number 46 in the song my Savior, first of all in number 46 in the song my Savior, first of all in number 46 in the song my Savior, first of all in number 46 in the song my Savior, first of all in number 46 in the song my Savior, first of all in number 46 in the song my Savior, first of all in number 46 in the song my Savior, first of all in number 46 in the song my Savior, first of all in number 46 in the song my Savior, first of all in number 46 in the song my Savior, first of all in number 46 in the song my Savior, first of all in number 46 in the song my Savior, first of all in number 46 in the song my Savior, first of all in number 46 in the song my Savior, first of all in number 46 in the song my Savior, first of all in number 46 in the song my Savior, first of all in number 46 in the song my Savior, first of all in number 46 in the song my Savior, first of all in number 46 in the song my Savior, first of all in number 46 in the song my Savior, first of all in number 46 in the song my Savior, first of all in number 46 in the song my Savior, first of all in number 46 in the song my Savior, first of all in number 46 in the song my Savior, first of all in number 46 in the song my Savior, first of all in number 46 in the song my Savior, first of all