Look, we got to preach the gospel. That's the first works, isn't it? And if we're going
to be faithful to... God's saying, look, I'm about to take this church's candlestick away
because they're not preaching the gospel. So if we're going to be a faithful church,
we got to be preaching the gospel, which means ergo, we got to have the Bible. What are we
talking about right now? We're not talking about the least commandments. We're talking
about the greatest. We're talking about the most important. But we see the people that
are faithful and the least, they're also going to be faithful in much. If you're faithful
with what book you got, you're going to be faithful in the gospel. And not only that,
you're going to be faithful preaching the gospel as well. Pastor Jonathan Shelley was
biblically ordained by Pastor Steven Anderson on July 16th, 2018. After getting sent out
to start his own church in Houston, Texas, the 31-year-old has already been triggering
the God haters of the world with his face-ripping sermons. Without understanding, covenant breakers,
without natural affection, implacable, unmerciful. Man, the Bible just keeps saying, hey, you
can just understand what these people are like. Don't believe the lies of Hollywood
today. Don't believe the lies of the media today. Don't believe the lies of the world
today. Read your Bible. That's truth. Pastor Shelley isn't just a dynamic preacher. He
also teaches the Bible and is sound on doctrine. The native of Stormville, New York spent a
little over two years learning at Faithful Word Baptist Church before getting his chance
to lead his very own congregation. Pastor Shelley is one of the latest men of God to
get ordained and join the front lines of the spiritual fight as a representative of the
new IFB movement. And he's my next guest on the Preacher Profile interview series. Ladies
and gentlemen, from Pure Words Baptist Church, please welcome Pastor Jonathan Shelley. Hello
everyone and welcome to another edition of the Preacher Profile interview series. This
has been the Baptist and this time I'm joined by Pastor Jonathan Shelley from Pure Words
Baptist Church. Pastor Shelley, thank you so much for taking the time to come on here
for this episode of Preacher Profile. How you doing? Doing great. Thanks so much for
having me on. I've been able to see a few of your different interviews and I've seen
some of your video clips and you know, I just really appreciate your zeal. You know, it's
hard to find people that have any zeal today. Everybody's so apathetic. It's ridiculous.
So I just like somebody that is excited about the Bible and the things of God. So this is
a lot of fun for me. Well, thank you very much for that and certainly I would say the
same thing about you. You definitely have an infectious zeal the way that you preach
and it's definitely an honor to get an opportunity to speak to you. Somebody I've been listening
to for quite some time now and let's start things off like I always do. The beginning
of your journey, I want to ask you this. How did you find out about the new IFB? How did
you get involved in this movement and become a member of Faithful Word Baptist Church over
there in Tempe, Arizona? Well, you know, when it comes to the word new IFB, I guess that's
kind of a more recent thing. You could say whenever I first started listening Pastor
Anderson, I, you know, I didn't even know that was a thing, but sure. I mean, I always
grew up in a Christian home. I went to church, but I went to like big non-denominational
churches, no doctrine. They gave lip service to the right gospel, but they didn't really
actually believe it and took me a long time to even figure that out. But really for me,
it was the coming of my first child that kind of got me interested in just, you know,
not have a superficial knowledge of the Bible, but actually having a real knowledge of the
Bible. So I started actually searching things, looking up things myself and strangely enough,
you know, I don't agree with this ministry, but Ken Ham is kind of like what got me interested
in changing my viewpoint on a lot of different things because I'd never heard of young earth
creationism in my entire life. And even though his preaching and a lot of his material is
pretty weak, you know, when I look at it from now, even back then it was still so powerful
because it was so, so much of the truth of the fact that, you know, God's creation and
the timeline of the Bible. So that just kind of got me really interested in the Bible because
I'd never heard that before. I grew up in church my whole life. I'd never heard about
young earth creationism or any of these things. And so that's what kind of led me down a path
to really question, you know, what does the Bible really have to say? You know, I had always grown
up in church and read different parts of the Bible, but I don't think I'd ever read it cover
to cover. I wasn't King James only at the time. And that led me to Kent Hovind, who actually then,
you know, was way better than Ken Ham. He was King James only. And after researching the King James
only position, you know, I was immediately, you know, converted. I was like, wow, the King James
Bible is definitely the word of God. I can't find a single error in it. This thing's so much more
powerful than the other versions. And so just the King James issue alone really converted me on a
lot of different doctrines. And I was really kind of just changing my, you know, viewpoint on a lot
of things. And then eventually researching the King James only position, I found a video because I
was watching a lot of James White and Sam Gipp. Cause they were kind of like the only guys I could
find that were like arguing about the King James only position. And, uh, you know, I, there's a lot
of things that Sam Gipp were saying sounded right. And so I saw a video clip though, by a guy who was
making a response video to James White and it was Pastor Anderson. It was like response to James
White's response to Sam Gipp or something. It was a strange kind of video clip. And you know, the
video editing was really poor, but the content was great. It was Pastor Anderson just ripping on
James White for mispronouncing a lot of words that are in the King James Bible and trying to make it
sound like the King's Bible is stupid. Yeah, exactly. You know what I'm talking about? And then
Pastor Anderson, you know, he was attacking the fact that James White had said the King James Bible
is like old English or middle English or something. So Pastor Anderson quotes Beowulf to show how
stupid it would be to say that the King James Bible is old English or middle English, when in fact
it's technically modern English. And so that video just kind of got me hooked to want to hear some of
his other preaching and some of the other videos. And the first Pastor Anderson sermon I listened to,
I don't know if I can remember, but it was just so much Bible. It really just blew me away. I'd never
heard preaching like that before. Uh, it was really exciting because not only was he using a lot of
Bible, but it was making sense. Like the Bible, he was fitting the Bible together. He's comparing
spiritual with spiritual. And so I was hooked and I just started listening to a ton of his
preaching. It really even helped, you know, me make even more change in my life, get a lot of
the worldliness out. I had already made a lot of doctrinal changes. So I would say that from a
doctrinal perspective, you know, perspective, I was just looking for that Pastor Anderson out
there. I was like, where is the person that, you know, is against drinking alcohol and believes in
the King James Bible and faith alone and all these things. And so, so refreshing to find
something that actually stood for what the Bible said, but then, you know, just other aspects of
worldliness and other things, you know, Pastor Anderson really rips on those and kind of gets
you want to go to the right church, you know, actually serve the Lord. And so I was just trying
to find a good independent Baptist church in my area after listening to his preaching for a while.
And I just couldn't find one. It was a really frustrating time in my life, even my, me and my
wife, it was a very trying time of our marriage because we didn't necessarily see eye to eye on
doctrine, but there wasn't really a church for us to go to. And we were just trying to grow and,
you know, just figure out what to do, where to take our family. And so I think in that transition
of not being able to find a church is what really put in my heart, the desire to want to pastor one
day, because I honestly, at that time, I said, I just want to go to a good church and learn soul
winning. Like it's, it's, it's obviously super important in the Bible. It's clear. That's why
we're on this earth. I had had, you know, for a long time believed it's important to get people
saved. You know, my whole life, I kept trying to do it. I was trying to do it at my non non-church,
but I was not knowing how to do it. I wasn't successful. I saw Pastor Anderson's videos on
like how he was getting people saved. So it was really, you know, my desire to just find a good
church and go soul winning. And because I couldn't find it, I said, well, you know,
if no one's going to do it, like, I guess I can try, you know, or I could do it.
And so that's when I started, you know, researching, like, what does it take to
become a pastor? And I listened to some of Pastor Anderson's, you know, videos of,
on the qualifications of a Bishop and I was reading my Bible. And so I'd kind of determine
what it would take for me to get there. And I had actually, we had found an independent
Baptist church in our area that we started going to, and it was, it was good enough. You know,
there were King James only, at least there were pretty much right on the gospel. So
we were going there and it was a blessing for us at the time, but they still had lots of issues.
And I, they had gone through a pastor change and I had approached actually both pastors about the
fact that I wanted to be a pastor one day. And I asked them, Hey, would you train me? You know,
what would you be willing to do? And the first guy said he wasn't just because he
was making the transition, but the second guy said, sure, you know, but it might take a while.
And so he wasn't really doing anything. He wasn't, he wasn't asking me to preach. He
wasn't asking me to do anything. Every time I brought up soul winning, he was like, yeah,
we'll eventually do that. And so it was pretty slow process and nothing was really happening.
Then the church kind of deteriorated and it's preaching and it's doctrine.
And so I kind of in my heart already decided once I was about ready, I would probably just go to
faith word Baptist church for like one year, just so that I would be sent out from pastor
Angela's church. Cause I knew if I leave this other church and they realize what I start
preaching, I'm probably going to lose all fellowship. So I said, I might as well find
a church that is actually going to agree with me more that I agree with them more
and be sent out from them. And I also think it's important. I mean, the Bible makes it clear,
everything brings forth after its own kind. So if I want to be like pastor Anderson,
or if I want to be like Roger, which were, you know, kind of the two main guys that I
was looking at at that time, I said, I need to go to one of their churches. You know,
I need to learn from these guys. And the one thing that was interesting for me is I always
had this hypothetical question. I said, if I lived at any time in the Bible, when would I want to
live? And I always immediately would just say the time of Jesus Christ. Cause I said, I would just
want to follow Jesus Christ. I would want to be there and see him and talk to him and just be,
you know, part of that ministry. And I said, well, the thing is Christ put me on this earth
for a reason. And I wasn't putting that timeline. So if I would have followed Christ back then,
what would that mean today? And I said, well, that would be finding the most red hot fire preacher
that I can find today and going and following him. And so that's what caused me. I'm like,
I'm just, I'm going to go to faith word Baptist church and I'm going to try to serve the Lord
the best I can. If I was truly honest in the fact that I follow Christ, that's what I would do.
And so that's what led me to faith word Baptist church in 2016, we moved in the middle of the
summer. And, uh, you know, it was great. It was, it was one of the top five best decisions of my
life. You know, there's, I can't say enough good things about faith word Baptist church.
One of the best things I think that's kind of underrated or most people don't even realize
is just the fellowship. There's just so many other great people in that church.
It's great being around like-minded friends. You know, there's all these kinds of different things
to do, people to talk to. And it's really refreshing because outside those walls,
it's tough to find somebody that you agree with on very much so. Right. It's like when you walk
into faithful word or when you walk into steadfast or when you walk into Verity, everyone's normal.
Whereas in the world, people are crazy. Exactly. It's tough to find normal people. You're right. I
mean, it used to seem like most people are pretty normal and these days it's, it's a jungle out
there. And so I love being a favorite Baptist church, you know, being under pastor Anderson's
leadership and getting here and preach every three times a week and going to the preaching class and
everything. It was just an invaluable experience. And I kind of came there with the goal of being
there for two years. So pretty much the first or second week I was there, I approached pastor
Anderson. I said, Hey, I came here to be sent out. He said, when do you want to be sent out?
I said, two years. He said, if you work hard and diligent and meet all the requirements, then
I'll send you out after two years. And so, you know, I had a lot of work to do and,
you know, I just tried to keep that pace and at about two years, you know, it was time to go.
And so I then ended up making the transition to start the church in Houston, Pure Words Baptist
Church. And doesn't it feel good to do it God's way, to do it the right way? This is a common
theme I keep bringing up every time I do one of these interviews because I'm interviewing people
who are biblically qualified to do what it is that they're doing. And you didn't take any shortcuts.
You didn't cut any corners. You moved your family to Faithful Word Baptist Church to get ordained
the right way. And look how it worked out for you. God has blessed your ministry.
Whereas a guy, and again, I know I keep bringing him up, but this heretic unsaved false prophet
weirdo, Tyler Doka, and his effeminate evangelist, he was basically like a chameleon in that
Calvinist church he was going to. And then he gets quote ordained and starts that fake in New York,
that fake church in New York, where he just makes a mockery of the Bible. You know, every time these
people are unqualified, they end up getting exposed as nut jobs, as nut cases.
Yeah. I mean, it's tough for me on that one because like, I didn't like Tyler Doka from day one.
And I mean, you know, the thing for me, it was a little bit frustrating from my perspective,
just because I felt like a lot of people kind of quickly embraced these bozos too. And so
here's the thing, if Tyler Doka, if everybody had just day one, just said, well, you're an idiot
loser. That's trying to, you know, scapegoat around biblical qualifications. You know,
everybody would ignore them. It wouldn't even have been a thing, right? Like I do probably
have five viewers on YouTube, him and Justin and their three fake accounts. So, you know,
the thing is like, I looked at his website, like pretty soon after he came, you know, kind of was
trying to be a part of our group or whatever. And if you go to his website, he had a picture of him,
his wife, and his like, I don't know, six month old daughter or something. And he had put Titus
chapter number one, right next to his picture. And then he just bolded certain parts of the text.
So he's just like husband of one wife. It's like, you know, 36 font, you know, point font or
something. It's like huge. Or also he bolds, you know, having faithful children. And it just,
it just really ate me up because I'm like, I care what the Bible says. And like, how can you
literally have a picture mocking the text that you have bolded right next there? And pretty soon
after, I think it was about three or four weeks later, you know, there was kind of like this
scandal of like Kenneth McCraney and a couple other guys just causing a bunch of issues and
doing weird stuff or whatever. And eventually then pastor Anderson even came out and made
a video saying like, I'm no longer going to support somebody that's not, you know,
toeing the line or whatever when it comes to the biblical qualifications. And I went and checked
his website and he had unbolded that section of his website. And so I was like, I said, I want to
go prove that. So I went to, there's a thing, you know, way back machine. I don't know if you know
that website, but it archives the entire internet, but his site wasn't long around long enough for
having a backlink. So it never got archived. So I couldn't prove it. But because, because he
changed it, okay. He no longer had the argument of being ignorant in my opinion, which was an
interesting thing for me because I said, you know, some guys that go to Bible college and they get
lied to by the old man, kind of like the prophet that condemned Jeroboam. He gets lied to by the
old man saying, no, it's okay. Come eat with me. You know, even though it was against what God's
word says. And so they just kind of go along with it and make a mistake. But when he unbolded the
font and just left it up there, it wasn't, it wasn't that he was ignorant. He was choosing to
be deceptive. And at that point, I really had a bad taste in my mouth with the guy. And I just,
you know, even before he came out and was a clearly unsaved, I mean, I made some video
attacking him, just saying like, you know, I'm going to have nothing to do with this guy.
If someone's not biblically qualified, that's kind of a line in the sand for me.
Like, I'm not going to support that guy's church. I'll be there for, you know,
if someone came to my church and wants to go soloing with me, whatever, you know, I'll go,
I'll go soloing with an unsaved person, but I'm not going to recommend someone's church or a
pastor that's not biblically qualified. I don't want to be a partaker of their evil deeds.
And so, you know, you know, and I talked about this with Matthew Stuckey, who I just featured on
this video podcast. And to me, I look at a guy like Matthew Stuckey and yourself, and it's, you
know, these guys that worked really hard and I'm sure you were, and we're going to talk about it,
everything you went through to get ordained. And then he sees some guy cutting the line
for filthy lucre sake, in a sense, just to attach his name to a movement he thinks he can inject
with poison. And that's what pissed me off the most about Tyler Doka and people like him who
tried to circumvent the biblical qualifications to preach. You know what? Just come right out and
say, listen, I'm under qualified right now. Do it the right way then. And only then will God bless
you. Yeah. I mean, one of the qualifications of a Bishop says not self-willed. And for me,
that sums it up. What's more important, following God's commandments or you being a pastor?
And the guy that decides that the qualifications doesn't matter, he's basically just admitting
that it's more important for him to be a pastor than follow God's commandments,
which is never true. It's always more important to follow God's commandments.
Amen to that. Amen to that. And certainly it's about attaining that title of pastor
rather than feeding the flock of God. Now I want to talk about that move you mentioned in 2016 to
Faithful Word Baptist Church. And I apologize if you had already touched on this, but
how far was that move? From where did you move to go to Tempe, Arizona?
Yeah, I lived in Texas. I lived in what's considered West Texas, but I think it's more
North Texas. It was near Amarillo. I lived in a small town. It was, I can't remember exactly
the number of miles. It's probably like 700, 750 miles in that range. And it was maybe like 11
hour drive without kids. So with kids, it's just, you know, multiply that number by some factor.
But, you know, I mean, it was funny because when we moved, there was like four or five other
families that have moved in a very recent time as well. And it was like Alaska, New Jersey,
Florida. So it was like, we weren't special. As far as like people that were showing up.
But at the same time, you know, there's how many people have said they want to move and then they
don't. So, you know, obviously moving even just two hours can be difficult. It's, you know,
there's a lot of stress on your finances. It's a lot of decisions you have to make. It's, you know,
it's definitely not something that's easy. But like I said, it was one of the best decisions
I've ever made. And I think anything that's worth it's never easy. Raising kids, getting married,
you know, preaching the truth. A lot of times it's not necessarily always easy, but
you're always going to be satisfied in the end.
Now that style of preaching, the hard preaching, you know, preaching against sin, talking about
how the sodomites should be stoned to death and all the rest of it. Obviously now you are a fire
breathing preacher and, you know, you're certainly not one of these mamby pamby old IFB soft as
Charmin ultra level preachers. Okay. You preach hard, but was it always like that for you,
Pastor Shelley? Did it take an adjustment period for you to see? Because, you know,
some people when they get exposed to Pastor Anderson, at first, they're a little bit
adverse to it. They're like, you know, maybe this guy's a little too much for me. And there's an
adjustment period before they really embrace it. Did that same adjustment period, did you have to
go through that yourself or did you just automatically kind of embrace his style?
Yeah. I mean, for me, I think the harder, the more I enjoyed it. I don't know.
You know, I, I grew up in, you know, not churches that I agree with anymore. I'll be honest. Like
they were non-denial charismatic churches, but you know, sometimes they would preach what was
considered a hard sermon where they're preaching honest, particular sin. You know, most of the
time they're hard preaching. It was untying. Okay. But at least whenever they would preach hard,
I still liked it. I mean, I still liked, you know, what the Bible has to say. And I liked,
you know, trying to live, trying to live a godly life, even though it was, you know, misguided,
a lot of things they said, but you know, with Pastor Anderson, there was only pretty much
one thing that I didn't immediately agree with in his preaching, but it wasn't because of hard
preaching. It was just my lack of, you know, Bible study or, and, you know, just having
misconceptions about certain passages or even his viewpoint or what he's trying to say. So
for me, the harder, the better. I think I was seeking out the hardest sermons right away.
That's awesome. You know, it's funny when I brought my girlfriend at the time was my wife,
who I'm married to now, my wife, I brought her to Steadfast Baptist Church back when the church
had first began. And, you know, as a visitor, people were wondering after the sermon because
Brother Fennan had preached a really hard sermon about reprobates and hell and how reprobates are
twice dead and eosotomites are just a bunch of pedophiles. I mean, he just went off. I mean,
he preached a really hard sermon. After the service, people went up to me, they said, hey,
was Alicia, which is her name, they said, was she offended? And, you know, I kind of laughed because
in the middle of the sermon, I remember looking at me with this smile on her face and I'm like,
this is not a sermon for you to be smiling at. But she had just been begging for a pastor to
just rip some face and was so enjoying it. And I think that's kind of the reaction you
probably had as well. Yeah. I mean, I, when it came to, especially on the sodomite issue,
like I'd always thought that they should be put to death. I've never had a problem with that.
I didn't necessarily completely understand the fact that they couldn't be saved just because I
was like really hardcore John three 16 thinking, you know, no matter what or whatever. And so
obviously that you're just misapplying, you know, those two concepts to, if you, if you're still
stuck on that. But for me, I, I loved the hard preaching. I loved people taking a stand. One
thing that I was fine. I was trying to find, I was trying to find a sermon against alcohol.
Like I knew it was wicked. I knew it was a sin and every single clip they're just like,
well, it's not the best thing, but it's still pretty good. And the Bible says it's a blessing,
but only moderation, but you know, you couldn't even find anybody. Just say it was a sin.
And it was just like, I want someone to get up and preach hard about this thing.
And I heard pastor Anderson's drunkards and wine bibbers. One of the first sermons I listened to,
I loved it. I was just like, this is great. I even, I felt like, you know, maybe the hair
on my arms is tangling a little bit, but you're on the back of my neck. Cause it was like so hard,
but I was just, I needed it. I wanted it. It was great.
Now, what was it like learning under pastor Anderson? Obviously you went to faithful
word Baptist church with the intention to one day get sent out to pastor yourself.
And you, you got to be trained by pastor Anderson at an amazing church.
What was that like? Did you interact with them? Was it like kind of a weekly thing where he
sat down with you and taught you the robes, showed you the robes? I mean, what was that like?
Yeah. I mean, it's definitely a very unique experience. I think I've had a lot of different
instructors in different ways in my life. And the one that I think pastor Anderson,
he has a unique style when it comes to training. And a lot of his training is,
is more like by example, I think, um, you know, he's not going to be real hands-on.
And I think a lot of that is, is by design and the fact that he, he doesn't want to, you know,
hold someone's hand out the door to go start a, you know, red hot fire writing church. He wants
you to be fired up. So he's going to give you all the tools and the ability and the necessary,
you know, the necessary things. But at the end of the day, he's going to kind of let you
be you. And, and so I think for his style, honestly, it's just going to shy people that
are weak are just never going to handle it well. You know, weak men aren't going to want to approach
him. Aren't going to talk to him. Aren't going to take the bull by the horns. And so it's kind
of effective in the sense that it's only going to really work for people that really want it and
have a desire. And I think, you know, one of the things I really liked about being there in the
church was you kind of get more used to hard preaching as, as you go to the church and as you
get to hear more sermons. But the one thing that I was really impressed by is every single time
he preached, I was just very in awe of the fact that he was coming up with some type of a fresh
viewpoint. Even, even a sermon, like you'll start off the sermon and it's like about baptism.
And so, you know, in the flesh, you're just kind of like, ah, baptism, you know,
but he just still made the sermon have a fresh perspective. You could tell he wasn't just
regurgitating something. He didn't just kind of phone it in it all. Every sermon felt like he'd
put a lot of preparation into, uh, you know, he was definitely very diligent and methodical
and how he was selecting his sermons. And so whenever you see someone preach 150 sermons a year,
that's much different than other churches. The church that I grew up in, the pastor preached
like 25 times a year for 25 minutes. So 150 plus sermons for an hour long, you know,
each, and they're all unique. It's, it's very, uh, impressive. It definitely inspires you to
want to follow in that zeal. And I would think it takes an incredible amount of Bible knowledge
to do that, which is why he requires, to my knowledge, pastor Shelley, that the people he
sends out have to have read the Bible cover to cover a certain amount of times. Is it 10 times
or so? Yes, there's 10 times. Right. And obviously you have to have that knowledge to be able to come
up with those original ideas, those original sermons each and every week. And folks,
pastor Shelley is the pastor of Pure Words Baptist Church. Make sure, I forgot to plug
this earlier. Make sure you subscribe to his YouTube channel to listen to him preach hard
and tear the house down every week over there in Houston. Now, pastor Shelley, let's fast forward
to your ordination. The day it finally came, uh, pastor Anderson lays hands on you to go, uh, send
you out to start your very own independent fundamental Bible believing Baptist church.
And now you're in the driver's seat. What are you thinking during your ordination, which I'm sure,
you know, many years were put in to get to that point. What's going through your head?
Yeah, I think it's one of those, it's just a lot of moments are a little bit surreal. You know,
I think like when your wedding day finally comes or, you know, your first kid, it's just kind of a,
it's kind of a surreal feeling a little bit. Um, it was, it's, it was a little bit, uh, of anxiety
just in the sense that, you know, I'm really comfortable at faith for a Baptist church
is really nice being here. I really like the brethren and now I'm going to go out and do
something new and I'm kind of having to say goodbye to something that I love. And so it was,
it's a little bit bittersweet because, um, you make a lot of good relationships and friendships
and it would be easy to just want to stay and in not necessarily even have the pressure that
a pastor would. Right. You kind of just sit back and listen to pastor Anderson preach
three times a week. It's pretty nice compared to now I have to get up there and, you know,
try to deliver a message and bring people in. And, but because, you know, that's so important
and because I have that desire to provide that for other people, you know, I already felt ready
and, um, I knew that I was capable. I think a lot of people would ask me this question. They say,
so are you ready? And, you know, I think that's a tough question because you say,
are you ready for kids? Are you ready for marriage? I don't think anybody's ready.
I think it's more of a question of, are you re are you willing and capable of doing it?
And, you know, I was willing and capable, you know, here my Lord send me. So
it's kind of, it's a once in a lifetime experience. You know,
I think it's funny that you mentioned Ken Ham earlier because I kind of have a similar story
in that I found out about young earth creationism as a result of stumbling on
one of Ken Ham's videos. Now, obviously I wouldn't want anything to do with them, but
it's interesting because these guys that are all about apologetics and things like that
at a time, you know, there was a time where I was kind of sucked into that and watching
all those apologetics videos, which is why I loved your sermon. I believe it was preached at
after BBC North, where you ripped on apologetics and you said, how's this for apologetics?
What must I do to be saved? Going soul winning. There's your apologetics,
not these bunch of, you know, pseudo intellectual debates and arguments people make.
And I'm not really sure what that had to do anything. I just popped into my mind,
but I appreciated that sermon you preached there on apologetics, but you get ordained,
Pastor Shelley, you get ordained by Pastor Anderson. You get sent out to Houston to start
your church brand new. The cord's already been cut. Are there, you know, any challenges at first?
Are you thinking, man, this is a little bit more difficult than I anticipated?
Well, it's definitely very difficult. You know, obviously you can't fully know,
you can't fully know how difficult marriage is or having a child until you really experience it. But
obviously you, you listen to the wisdom of other men that have gone out before you and they say,
you know, it's really stressful. It's very difficult. There are a lot of challenges. And so
that first week was real tense, real intense because, you know, some, some people, you know,
they just start in the home and then they kind of grow into a building or like Adam Fannin,
he kind of gets the benefit of having pastor, you know, Marrow there to also help them kind
of get it started. There's already all these people in anticipation. So obviously they kind
of had to scramble and get a lot of things done in a short period of time, but I was trying to
just wham bam, just show up first service, have a building, you know, do all these things. And so
I think I added a lot of stress under myself, you know, in the first week, but it was,
I just wanted to get it all done and just kind of like have it ready. And then I can just kind
of figure things out as I go, as opposed to having just big chunks over and over again for a few
months. So there's definitely a lot of work. It's, it's not for the faint of heart. It's not somebody
that, you know, you don't just wake up one day and start a Baptist church. So it takes a lot of
planning, effort, energy, you know, it's a lot of stress on the family. So, you know, it's
definitely something that you should go in with the anticipation of it's hard work, but I said
anything that's worth it, you know, is going to be hard. You know, you were there at faithful word
Baptist church, when the pretend Pentecostals, when these oneness heretics were getting exposed
one after the other, obviously it started with Tyler Baker. It eventually led to Garrett
Kershway getting outed. And, and, and you're there, you're watching all this occur.
Do you anticipate as the pastor of your own independent Baptist church, that one day you
might get under attack with heretics trying to infiltrate, obviously the Bible warns that that
will occur. And as you saw pastor Anderson deal with it, did you take some notes and, and, and,
and kind of learn from him on how to withstand those attacks from the devil?
Yeah, honestly, interestingly enough, I think it's great. I sort of hope I have that happen to me
just because it seems like then I'm doing something right. You know, you don't have
anybody attacking you, then it seems like you're not doing anything. So, you know,
there's always going to be haters and infiltrators. It seems like because pastor Anderson
is such a sharp point of the tip of the spear that he kind of gets most of the hate and most of the
enemies just want to kind of go after him. So, you know, fortunately for my church,
I really haven't even had, you know, anything like that, or there's nothing on the radar.
Obviously you never know. Judas can always be amongst you. Right.
But I think it was an invaluable experience to literally almost every single person that was
thrown out of faith, where Baptist church literally came to my house and had dinner with me.
Okay. So it was a very firsthand experience. Right. And while Tyler Baker, his best friend
was obviously Rick Martinez. Like if you asked me who I was best friends with, I probably would
have said Tyler, just because he was the person I interacted with the most and talked to the most.
And, you know, it wasn't like a super close relationship, but just of the people that the
church, since he's, you know, also in the North and he's the deacon, I'm kind of dealing with him
a lot. And so ended up, we would hang out with his family and, you know, I, we liked their family.
I liked his wife. I liked his daughter, you know? And so it was definitely a very trying situation
because especially when it comes out, you know, I didn't, Tyler had never said anything to me.
None of those guys that ever, you know, breathe the word of this weird doctrine. So from my
perspective, I'm kind of just getting little bits and pieces here and there, and it's slowly coming
and, you know, everything pastor Anderson's saying, it's not like I'm not believing him
necessarily, but, you know, it's just kind of like hard to want to believe that, you know,
this person is just this horrible heretic, you know, false prophet or whatever, until you actually
get to see it yourself, you know? And it took him like a week to even come out with this video,
Tyler Baker, you know, actually saying all of this weird junk. And
it was almost like a Twilight film that felt like, cause it was just so surreal.
I never really thought something like that would happen. And pastor Anderson in the preaching
class, the first week he had it with, it was kind of like an open forum and there was quite a few
guys in there. He said, there's a Judas Iscariot in here right now. Like there's somebody in here
that's wicked. I've already seen it. And as he's saying this, I'm thinking there's nobody in here
that's a Judas. Like that's not going to happen. Like I just didn't believe it. You know, no matter
what, even though the Bible says it, like I just didn't really believe it. And comes to find out,
you know, you got Dominique Davis in there, you got here, you got Tyler Baker in there.
So it's like, there's multiple Judases literally sitting amongst you and you think there's like,
there's no Judas here or whatever. And so it really kind of, it gives me a lot better perspective.
I think the only danger with that situation was it's kind of easy for me to be like jaded or
bitter or like really suspicious of people. And so kind of finding that balance of how do you
trust people and then at the same time be very protective and guarded against wolves. You know,
when you're the pastor, I mean, you're the guy that's got to make sure that these people aren't
coming in and destroying your church. So I think it's a great experience to have gone through. So
I get to see it firsthand and I'm not going to be shocked when it happens. You know, I went,
I got the opportunity to preach at Old Path Baptist Church and I preached a sermon called
Tyler Baker Shall Come. And you know, lo and behold, what happens a few months later? Well,
this Hector Alvarado kid gets exposed as some loser oneness heretic, you know, and even some
of the people there were kind of like, it's really hard to believe there'd be a Judas amongst us,
you know? And it's like, I was there, been there, done that, you know? And so it's not going to
surprise me, I think, when it happens, the fact that it happens, but it's always going to be a
surprise who it is. And so I think just realizing you're going to have raw emotion and some parts
of your flesh may not want to believe that so-and-so is a heretic loser or whatever. But
at the end of the day, if your loyalty is the King James Bible and your loyalty is to the man of God,
then you're not going to have a problem, you know, moving on. Yeah. And you know,
that's spiritual warfare. If you're going to do work for God, the devil will respond. And I like
what you said there. Hey, I'm looking forward to it because if that happens, then I'm doing work.
That means I'm actually making an impact. And let's talk about now, obviously, you know,
you've been a pastor for some time now. How do you study your Bible? I mean, I'm interested
to know this because there've been a few sermons you've put out lately where I've sat there and
said, man, you know, this is good stuff. And I'll give you a couple of examples. You put out a James
two sermon, which I completely a hundred percent agree with. That's exactly how I've used James
two. I thought it was great. Isaiah nine, six though. That's the big one. And pastor what's
interesting about the internet today is you can put up a sermon and obviously you are preaching
to your congregation, but the impact you're making kid can be felt across the country.
And I remember walking into church and talking to some of the brothers in Christ there about
that Isaiah nine, six interpretation you had about the everlasting father. I said,
that was brilliant. So how do you come up with these sermons in a sense of what's your Bible
study? Like, what are you doing to learn the Bible, to study the Bible and to learn doctrine
the way that you do? Well, you know, I can't take credit for anything because obviously
99% of everything I've learned has been from other men. And, you know, obviously the Holy
Ghost is what leads us and guides us and teaches us the Bible. And so, you know, from, from my
perspective, I think one of the most underrated things is just Bible memorization. And so,
you know, when you really memorize portions of the Bible, I think it unlocks deeper knowledge
and the two instances that you're, um, bringing up when it comes to James two and Isaiah nine, six,
it's interesting because both of those for me just have like very personal situations.
Like they're, they're both very personal passages. So I've just studied, I just thought about those
passages a lot. And so whenever you read the Bible cover to cover, you know, things you're
going to stick out more, you're going to have, you're going to be able to compare spiritual,
spiritual, and I think just, just meditating on those passages, really thinking and just trying
to always take context and consideration. I think, unfortunately, context is very much disregarded.
And the more you read the Bible, you realize it's always in context. Like the Bible doesn't
have just these, you know, obviously maybe even with Proverbs, it seems like it's just kind of
random, random, random. I still believe when you read Proverbs that these chapters have
overlaying context, overlaying themes that, you know, really put all these different verses
together. And so when I've heard different James two sermons, my whole life, they're always out of
context. They don't have any real basis. And so just reading it, reading it tons and tons of times,
meditating on it, thinking about it and just learning from others. You know, I,
I like listening to people's interpretations of the Bible and whenever you can pretty much tell
when somebody's on because they're just taking spiritual to spiritual and comparing it. And
it's just like the Holy ghost is just like, yep. And it just makes sense. It's usually when people
just kind of just start talking a lot on their own that you're like, Oh, okay. You know,
not really, they're not giving any of the verses. They're just kind of saying stuff. And it's like,
I've heard that kind of preaching my whole life. So I think you really have to have spiritual,
and to, and to me, like the Isaiah nine six, it's like, it's a clear prophetic prophecy of the Lord
Jesus Christ. And I think it's really dangerous to take any passage like that and just start making
radical doctrines out of it. Unless you clearly know what the context is. I mean,
you have lots of portions of Psalms and all other places where it's like, it's like David speaking,
but then you can tell it's like Christ speaking, but then it's back to David,
you know? And so with Isaiah nine chapter or Isaiah nine six, you know, all those attributes
of Jesus Christ are true because just Jesus Christ is the same yesterday, today, and forever.
That's a good verse, right? Well, you might've triggered somebody here in Jacksonville,
but they're really picturing the millennial reign. They're really picturing the fact when
Christ is reigning. And so, these oneness heretics want to take this passage and really apply it to
the birth of Christ. And it's like, obviously it says a child is born, right? It starts out
with a child is born, but the fact that he's ruling and reigning, that he has the government
upon his shoulders is not in that first coming. It's when he's set up on his throne
in the millennial reign. And when you read the context, it's all about him ruling and reigning.
And so that's it. That's the key. And I want to read it. If you don't mind Isaiah chapter nine,
it says for unto us, a child is born unto us, a son is given and the government shall be upon
his shoulder. And his name shall be called wonderful counselor, the mighty God, the everlasting
father, the prince of peace, of the increase of his government and peace, there shall be no end
upon the throne of David and upon his kingdom to order it and to establish it with judgment and
with justice from henceforth, even forever, the zeal of the Lord of hosts will perform this.
And for those of you who don't know, and pastor Shelley, obviously you can cut in if I'm
misrepresenting you in any way, but you are the way that you taught that is it's a reference to
the fact that Jesus Christ will be an eternal ruler starting at the millennial reign.
I remember listening to that. I said, that's it that, that, you know, crack the code if you will.
And there was a guy, one of my close friends who obviously he didn't believe in the oneness
interpretation of this, but he never really could put his finger on what exactly it was referencing.
And now when I, when I hear the oneness interpretation and we'll get back to some of the
other stuff, I don't mean to go too far off topic here, pastor, but when I hear, when I hear the
oneness interpretation of that scripture now, pastor, it's even more retarded because it's
talking, everything is about the government of Jesus Christ. It calls him a counselor,
calls him a mighty God. And then it says the everlasting father, why would it randomly switch
to be teaching about the Godhead? Well, the thing is anytime you take any verse,
right. And if you're going to say, well, it has a secondary or tertiary, uh, meaning you still also
have to take that and apply it to the primary meeting. So if what you're saying has, it doesn't
fit with the primary meaning, then you're probably way off. And when you see the sandwich
of government, I mean, it's literally starts with government and ends with government.
You got to say, okay, well, let's first get the primary interpretation. And then from there,
we can try to draw secondary and third applications. I've never heard one of these
oneness guys try to tell what the primary application of that verse is. They only are
going for what is in their mind of second or third, you know, application of trying to say,
well, this says, you know, Jesus is God, the father, you know, and there's plenty of places
where the word father's used. That doesn't mean, you know, God, the father, or even a
physical father, it just has other references. And so, you know, it's, it's important anytime
you're defining any word to know the context. Cause I, and I teach this to my church a lot.
I just say words have multiple definitions, every word in the Bible. God has multiple definitions,
right? Obviously in your kingdom's Bible, it helps you out by capitalizing when it's talking
about God and heaven as opposed to false gods, but not every language is like that. And, you know,
so you still have to make sure every single word wine is a common word where context defines what
we're talking about, you know? And so it's important when you see the word father, I like
the fact that it says everlasting. Cause what's the emphasis of this is the fact that it will
reign forever. You know, that's why he's the everlasting father. And I think what really
triggered me on, you know, maybe discovering this was just thinking about forefathers.
It was like, you know, we have forefathers founding fathers, founding fathers, exactly
like that. Or even with Paul, uh, he's talking about Timothy and he says, as a son is with the
father, you know, he's talking about Timothy, you know, training under him. Well, obviously Timothy
is not Paul's son in a physical sense. And so we even see Joseph when he says, Hey, I've been made
a father unto Pharaoh. I was like, there's another underlying message here. What father means?
It doesn't just, you know, represent one thing. And so, well, it defines it in that verse. Yeah.
It says, so now it was, so now it was not that it was not you that sent me hither, but God,
and he hath made me a father to Pharaoh and Lord of all his house and a ruler throughout all the
land of Egypt. So once you made that Genesis 45 connection, uh, anyway, that was good stuff.
We should probably move on to, but I really, I really appreciated that pastor. And, uh, yeah,
go ahead. No, I like, I like how it's words. It, it says it makes Joseph the ruler over everything,
right? Right. So whenever it says Jesus Christ is the Lord of Lord of kings, then they'll say,
well, then, you know, does that mean God, the father, where's the authority and blah, blah,
blah. But it's obvious in first Corinthians 15. That's why it says it is accepted that he,
you know, it is, it's obvious that he's accepted, which did put all things under his feet.
So it's just like the same picture of Pharaoh and Joseph. It's a picture of the Trinity. So.
Absolutely. And, uh, you know, I think that's the importance and, and this is what I wanted to lead
to, you know, obviously you study your Bible and you teach these things not to puff yourself up.
And it's funny cause on this Isaiah nine thing I wanted to do as soon as I heard that I wanted
to do a video and I'm like, man, that's what I believe. I want to do a video on it. But then
it's like, you know, I'll end up just ripping you off. So I figured I would just ask you.
It's not my truth. It's the Bible truth. I hear you. Um, but you know,
you don't do this to puff yourself up. You don't do this to be some sort of superstar.
You're doing it to edify people. Do you feel, uh, you know, you have a responsibility first
and foremost to that congregation that go and listen to you preach every week.
You ever think to yourself, man, this is a heavy burden, a heavy responsibility.
Obviously people should be reading the Bible for themselves, but you're feeding the flock of God.
How much of that is on, you know, how much of a responsibility is that to you
in terms of, you know, do you ever think about it and just the weightiness of it?
Yeah. I mean, it's, it's definitely, I don't think anybody could probably even take it
seriously enough. I think people look up to you, pastor.
Yeah. I mean, one of the most, I think probably the most agonizing thing for me
is picking what to preach just because honestly, I don't have a problem like coming up with ideas.
Like I have probably 200 ideas that I've stashed away, but it's like deciding, well, what's,
what's necessary to preach. Am I giving people a balanced diet? Am I preaching things that people
need? And, you know, am I, I don't want to be a one topic preacher. I don't want to, you know,
do all kinds of different things that would just kind of isolate me or bore the,
you bore the congregation or not feed the congregation or whatever.
And so, because it's such a big responsibility, I really struggle with what to preach.
And, you know, even when it comes to like Isaiah 9, 6 and James 2,
those are things that I've believed for probably six months or a year or three years.
Like there's plenty of things right now, even that I would like to preach or that I want to preach
that, you know, or maybe a little bit different, but I'm going to wait because I've decided I'm
going to memorize that entire chapter before I preach it. Even though I know, like I believe it,
even though I know, like, I think I'm a hundred percent sure, and this is right.
It's like, I just, I think you got to do due diligence and you don't want to just be this quick,
you know, guy to come up there and I've discovered everything new and whatever.
And when it comes to doctrines, like I believe that I believe everything the same as Pastor
Anderson. So it's not like I have some new doctrine. I'm just saying when it comes to
certain passages that even people within our own movement may have different, you know,
interpretations or viewpoints. I want to make sure that when I get up there,
I've studied myself to show up, or I've studied to show myself approved unto God.
Because it doesn't matter if I'm appeasing the people, if I'm displeasing God. And so
ultimately he's the one that's deciding how he's going to bless me. And so I've recently preached
a sermon about this and I try to hold myself to it because there was a lady who had called
and she was very distraught because she had been divorced and now she's realizing she's not going
to have any more kids with her, with this husband. And so she only has one daughter and she was very,
you know, calling me and trying to talk to me about this. And I said, well,
are you taking your one daughter to church? And she said, no. And I said, well, look,
why would God want to bless you with more children when you're not even taking the one kid you have
to church? And I said, you need to be faithful with what you have right now and don't get so
down on yourself. You have a child that's looking up to you. You're there. You have the biggest
influence in their life. You need to make the best of it for your child. And so I think that would,
for being a pastor, it could be easy for me in the flesh to look at other churches and say, man,
it'd be nice to have 300 people. It'd be nice to have a hundred people. It'd be nice to be full
time. And instead of thinking that way, I should think, am I being really diligent and taking a
good care of what I do have? And I feel super blessed with the people that have been coming
to my church. I have some great people that have been there from day one, and I feel really blessed
to be able to pastor, you know, the church that I have and the people that I have. And so even
if my church had two people in it, you know, it's a huge responsibility and it's something that
should always be taken with utmost respect because God's going to bless the guy that's faithful and
little. And so no matter what you have, what situation, even the guy that's not a pastor
that just gets an opportunity to preach, he should take all diligence and respect
under the opportunity to preach the word of God and take it seriously.
Amen. Remind me, what was the date of your first service?
August 5th.
And obviously the church is called Pure Words Baptist Church. Again, for those of you watching
this, make sure you subscribe on YouTube to that channel to hear the preaching for yourself,
Pure Words Baptist Church. Now, how did you come up with that name?
Yeah, coming up with a name is hard. I would imagine.
I threw around a lot of different things. Maybe it was like ego or something. I wanted to have
a unique name, but you know, at the same time, I was always grounded with the fact that it still
had to be, it had to be the right name. It had to be something from the Bible. It had to have
meaning and value. I was going to a church at the time called Arden Road Baptist Church,
and it was because the church was on Arden Road. And I thought that name was terrible.
I really liked Faith Word Baptist Church. I really liked Steadfast. And, you know,
I really liked both of those names because of where they were in the Bible,
because of what they meant. And so I was trying to think, well, what's super important?
And I was like, what's, and so I, one thing came to mind was Soul Winning. And I kind of thought
of Soul Winning Baptist Church. This was before Richard Miller had gone out to start and he,
you know, used that name. And there's other Soul Winning Baptist Churches that have existed
in the past. But I was just thinking, well, you know, Soul Winning is obviously the first works,
and it's super important. But at the end of the day, and I even preached a sermon, you know,
backing this up, I believe that the Bible is the most important thing. Because if the foundations
be destroyed, what can the righteous do? You know, if we don't have Christ, we can do nothing.
Obviously, without the Word of God, you can't even go Soul Winning. And so I like the fact that
I was going to name the church after something about the Bible. And the thing that changed my
life is the King James Bible. So why not name it Pure Words Baptist Church? That's our rock.
That's what we have to live by and to be sustained on. That's what's going to change men's hearts.
Not me, not somebody in the flesh. It's the Word of God that changes lives. It's quick and powerful
and sharper than any two-edged sword. So, you know, it just, it kind of when I thought of it,
I just loved the name. It just really worked. Now something about the name, I have to tell you this.
So I told Pastor Anderson the name, Pure Words Baptist Church. He did not like it.
He did not like the name. He was like, no, it's too hard to say. You got to go to Pure Word.
Baptist Church. It's way better. So then I went on a journey and I asked like 10 more people,
okay. Every single person said Pure Word Baptist Church. They did not like the plural.
But the whole reason I'm picking the name is because of Psalms 12, 6. And I'm like,
I had this idea already. I'm like, I'm going to put the verse on my wall. Like I'm going
to have it at my church. How can I have Pure Word Baptist Church? And obviously,
you know, the Bible says every word of God is pure. You know, so there's other references.
Obviously it is the pure word, but it was Pure Words Baptist Church. That was...
You wanted that direct quote from Psalm chapter 12 and you were going to have it,
whether people liked it or not.
You know, and honestly, Pastor Anderson disagreeing with me as it was a pretty big,
you know, thing. It wasn't something I took lightly, but at the end of the day, I was like,
you know, it's, it's Pure Words Baptist Church.
Well, you're an independent Baptist, so...
Yes, sir.
That's awesome. Now, when it comes to the... you went on a missions trip recently
and what I find fascinating about this is, and I spoke to a brother Enrique and brother Sean
Jolly about this in a live stream a few days ago. What I find fascinating is you learned,
to my knowledge, and again, correct me if I'm wrong, but you learned the Spanish language
in order to go on this trip, correct? Or is that something you had been working on?
And, and, and I know when you went on the trip, you were immersed in the language.
So just talk about learning Spanish and then the missions trip, you went to Imeris, Mexico.
Yeah. Technically this was my second time to go to Imeris.
Okay.
So the first time was, you know, maybe the big push to really get fluent or get to some level
of fluency in the language, you know, at least a conversational level to give the gospel.
But I'd taken Spanish in high school for three years, but I didn't really, it didn't really
stick. I didn't really know much still, especially after 10 years later or whatever.
And in January, Pastor Anderson of 2016, Pastor Anderson said, Hey, we're going to take a trip
to Imeris. And if you can speak Spanish and you want to at least one person to Christ, you can go.
And so that was my goal. I was like, all right, six months from now,
I got a goal. I got a target. And so I just really tried to push myself to get to the level where I
could, you know, preach the gospel because I had already known I was going to Houston. That was
pretty much already, you know, determined for several years. And Houston has about,
I don't know, 20, 25% of the population speak Spanish. It's a very large Spanish population.
Spanish population. And so to me, the goal of starting a church should be to reach everyone
in your city with the gospel. And if you have a demographic where 20, 25% of the people
don't speak English, like, how can, how can you just justify going there? I was like,
I have to learn the language. I have to get to the point where I can give them the gospel.
I don't like it when I knock on a door and someone, I can't give them the gospel.
And, you know, obviously that's going to happen on a small micro level. You're going to run into
people from Russia or India or Europe, but when it's that large of a percentage, you know,
even in Phoenix, it was a pretty large percentage. You know, it just, it just felt like a necessity
and I felt really compelled to do it. And so I just, I tried to use Duolingo as a primary
resource. I made some vocabulary lists. I tried to force myself to talk to different people,
the church that were fluent. And, you know, for me, when it comes to learning a language,
I think the most important thing is just always maintaining momentum. You just can't stop. Even
if it's just a little bit every single day, you just got to keep that momentum because as soon as
you stop, you lose a lot. And so, you know, you use it or you lose it and you just got to,
even if it's just five minutes a day, I find that that's just really important in, you know,
language learning that you just continue to just do that little bit and just kind of keep it fresh
and just kind of keep using it and just keep trying to learn. Because you're either going
in one of two directions. You're either learning more or you're forgetting. And so that's why it's
important to just keep pushing yourself and just trying to force yourself to learn a language.
Now, Soul Wading in Houston, I know that there's a contingent of people there who might not really
like your kind of church, but how is it like going Soul Wading there in Houston, Texas?
Yeah, I mean, it's honestly, overall, it's been great. One thing that really drew me to the area
that I put my church in is the fact that there's just tons of apartments. I've never seen as many
apartments in my life. And they are gold mines. Not only are there apartments, they're like low
end compartments. So it's even a double win. It's just, I mean, it's kind of, it's just
picking up apples off the ground. I mean, you just can't, you can't get a big enough basket.
You can't go enough hours. You know, we've done some other Soul Wading like in the neighborhoods
and some of the other areas. That's pretty rough. And the thing about Houston that's maybe different
than some areas, it's very church oriented city. So most people go to church. And so the difficulty
you have in Soul Wading is everybody already thinks they're saved. Everybody will say that
they believe in Jesus. It's, they just don't know what that means. It's, they have false doctrine,
they have false views. And so you really, yeah, you really have to overcome, you know, the repent
of your sins. You have to really overcome the fact that you can't just, you know, you can't
just live however you want. You know, you gotta live the life. You gotta live for Jesus. You know,
you gotta, you can't be a hypocrite. And so they really have a difficulty distinguishing the
difference between works in salvation. And so it's, it's a different type of Soul Wading than
other areas where maybe they're unchurched or have different obstacles to wanting to believe
in Jesus Christ. Very cool. And you know, you brought up that many people believe they're saved
and they profess Jesus Christ, Matthew 7 style. Here in Jacksonville, that's what I've noticed,
going Soul Wading is that same thing. When you're in that Bible Belt region, people are going to say
they believe in Jesus, but of course they're going to be infected with all kinds of false
doctrine and a false gospel. And in many cases, it sometimes can be a lot harder to deal with
them rather than somebody who's a completely just clean slate. Are there a lot of, are there
a lot of liberals there in Houston? Yeah, I'm sure there are, you know, it's a, it's a blue,
you know, dot on the map for sure. But, uh, in the area that we go Soul Wading, I mean, it's,
I think most of the people that are liberal are more just because they want the handout
rather than they have a radical ideology. You know, pretty much the one crazy city in Texas
is Austin. Everybody kind of knows that's where the real lunatics are, but obviously you're going
to run into them. You're going to run into reprobates. I ran into one recently this week and
you know, the, the strange things about it was I asked him if he was a hundred percent sure if
he died, he'd go to heaven. He said, yeah. And I said, well, what do you think someone has to
be saved? He said, believe in Jesus. And I said, do you think someone could lose their salvation?
He said, no, not at all. And here's the thing. A lot of people will quit there,
but I always like to ask, I say, well, do you think salvation's by faith alone or faith plus
living a good life? And for some reason that always seems to divide the goats from the sheep.
And he just immediately was like, well, you can't just live every one. And I said, okay, so, you
know, what all you have to do? And he's like, well, you can't, you can't just base your belief
on the Bible. I mean, the Bible is written by man. And I was like, what? And I, so then I was,
and it wasn't manifested. The guy was, you know, a sodomite. He wasn't necessarily, you know,
lisping too much at this point, but he, uh, I tried to prove a few verses about how the Bible
is the word of God and how we have to have some type of authority or we don't, you can't trust
anything. And he eventually was like, well, yeah, but the Bible, you know, doesn't even define
certain words. So we just have to figure it out ourselves. And I said like, what? And he said,
well, homosexuality. And I said, well, the Bible says men with men. We know what that means.
And he says, no, we don't. He's like, and I'm gay by the way.
And I just, so then I just ripped the invite out of his hand and I was like, all right, see ya.
And he was like, well, that wasn't very Christian of you, but it was actually, it was,
it was really obvious. Like this guy's not saved. He's not interested. He's never going to believe
the Bible. And, you know, people that just say, I'm not going to leave the Bible. It's written by
man. I don't waste my time preaching the gospel anyways. Cause you know, if they're not going to
believe in the word of God, like what, what chance do you have? Well, he ends up following me around.
Like I start preaching to his neighbor and in the middle of the gospel, he's like,
you want to, you want to know what this guy was saying to me in front of me?
So I was just like, get out of here. Nobody wants to hear what you have to say. And I was like,
do you want me to start reading Romans one, your judgment? And so I just kind of like damned him
to hell, but unfortunately his, you know, soy boy neighbor decided that was too much for him. So he
just crawled back inside. Didn't want to hear the gospel, but it's, it's just frustrating. These,
these reprobates, you know, the more you go soul winning, the more you believe the Bible
and the more it confirms itself and the more you believe Romans one. And you know,
I have family members attack me. They say, so you don't give homos the gospel. And I was like,
I said, I give the gospel to everybody that wants to hear it. But there's this really unique
phenomenon that every sodomite never wants to believe the Bible. They never want to hear the
gospel every time. That's not a coincidence. It's a reality. Yeah. And then when you try and exit
the conversation, because I just have this visceral reaction whenever I come across them,
I just want to get out of there as quickly as I possibly can. I know it's a predator. I know
that's a disgusting animal I'm looking at right now. I just want to leave. I want to move on to
the next person that's actually going to get saved. And then they follow you like they did
with you. And it's just so frustrating because at that point, they're doing the work of the devil,
trying to keep other people from getting saved, trying to keep other people from going to heaven
to pull them down to hell with them. Uh, it's just, that makes my blood boil when that happens.
You know, that's a perfect analogy. What does the Bible call them?
Dogs, dogs. When you go soul winning, they want to follow you and bark you. And they're so annoying.
And it's just, uh, so I actually like dogs better than I like sodomites, but same here.
And one last thing I wanted to tell you on just on the topic of soul winning, I actually went,
uh, soul winning, had a really interesting interaction with somebody brother Fannin at
this time had gotten into some hot water because he had published a clip, basically, uh,
instructing us on how to avoid a sodomite waiter. It went crazy and viral. Well,
I'm knocking on someone's door and it's actually someone who had recognized steadfast Baptist
church because of that clip. And it's this, you know, college girl or whatever. And she gets,
and she just reams me. I mean, she's just for like 10 minutes straight. You're hateful.
You're bigoted. How could you go to a church that says that? So finally she's done talking
and I'm like, well, more important than that. Are you a hundred percent sure? And then she just
lost it and slammed the door on me. So my point is pastor, uh, you've already gotten some media
attention. There was a atheist website that attacked you for preaching against the sodomites.
And I'm sure the heat level will continue to ramp up as people in the area know that you're there
and they might fight back against you. We saw what happened with Verity Baptist church and
obviously faithful word Baptist church. You told me you're ready for that,
but who knows? There might come a day pastor where you knock on the door
and they recognize you and they recognize pure words, Baptist church.
Yeah, I would sure hope so. Not for vain, not for vain sake, but just the fact that, you know,
the truth is getting out there and people are being saved and you know, not everybody likes
the truth. Not everybody wants to hear the truth, but you know, the demon said, you know,
I know Jesus and I know Paul, but who are you? And I don't want to be that guy. You know, who are you?
Okay. So I've had the same experience. The only time it's interesting, even in Phoenix though,
most people didn't know faith were Baptist church. And, but one time I had the same experience where
they recognized immediately. They were really visceral, very angry, screaming, cursing,
but it just happened to be that pastor Anderson was in a group leapfrogging us. And he walks by
like kind of one or one, you know, a few minutes after the conversation. And they like light up
like a firecracker once they see pastor Anderson, I mean, they're, you know, like death threats and
just like everything is going out. So it was a pretty eventful, you know, four or five minutes,
but I probably made the same mistake as you and spent too much time listening to their,
you know, verbal garbage or whatever. Yeah, I should have just walked away, but you know,
it's interesting because when I went to faithful word to visit, I thought that would happen.
I don't like every door, you know, I figured everyone knows pastor Anderson,
but many people just don't pay attention. So anyway, that's going to do it. Let's go ahead
and wrap it up now, pastor. I certainly appreciate your time. I know you have a very busy schedule
and it means a lot to me that you came on here and, you know, answered some of my questions.
I'm sure you've probably been asked some of this stuff a bunch of times already, but thanks for
sharing your story here on the preacher profile video podcast here on my YouTube channel. Is there
anything you want to plug a YouTube channel, a social media account, anything at all that you
want the people to know about before I go ahead and let you go? Why again, really much appreciate
the conversation. I appreciate your zeal and, you know, I hope there's more people that end up being
inspired to preach the word of God and do great things just from your ministry, from your videos.
I don't have anything to plug, you know, I think that, you know, if they want to subscribe to my
channel, that's great. But obviously, you know, Pastor Anderson channel, Steadfast Jacks is a
great channel. You know, Steadfast Baptist Church is doing great things. And so, you know, any of
these guys are going to learn a lot of great information. There's more than enough information
these days. So it's hard to keep up and that's great. I hope that it continues. I hope that
as there's more of us in the fight, you know, the less of the Sodomites want to fight us.
You know, it's pretty easy to pick on one or two guys, but when there's an army, it looks a little
bit more intimidating to want to come after the truth. Hey, I want to come out there and visit
sometime. Would you go soloing with me? For sure. You're always welcome. We'll have to see if we get
the Satan's minions attacking us like they did with you when you were over there in Phoenix.
All right, folks, that's going to do it. Pastor Shelley, thank you again. And folks, pure words,
Baptist Church, you have to go there and subscribe. I'm going to push it hard. He didn't. He's humble.
I'm going to do it for him. Go subscribe to the channel. All right, if you want hard preaching,
if you want the truth of the word of God, if you want a guy who's not going to hold back,
you're not going to get that soft old IFB style. No, he's a fire-breathing preacher. And if you
enjoy the preaching of guys like Pastor Donnie Romero, Pastor Steven Anderson, Pastor Roger
Jimenez, and others in the new IFB movement, you're going to like Pastor Jonathan Shelley.
Check out his YouTube channel again. It is Pure Words Baptist Church.
That's all I've got for this edition of the Preacher Profile Interview Series.
This has been The Baptist. YouTube.com slash Been The Baptist is the place to go if you want to
subscribe for more content from me. And until next time, like I always say, God bless you all.
I love you all unless you're a heretic. And I'll talk to you guys again very soon.
Thank you.