men chapter 12 of 2nd Corinthians 2nd Corinthians is a difficult book and 2nd
Corinthians chapter 12 is in particular a difficult chapter but there have been
a lot of great things that we've learned so far in this study and I think there
are gonna be some great things to learn tonight but we start out with this
passage at the very beginning that is a little bit hard to understand I've
heard this passage referred to in sermons my whole life I grew up in
an independent Baptist I've heard a lot of sermons that touched on this and it's
something that's hard to say for sure exactly what's meant here but let's go
through it and I'll expound it to you to the best of my ability it says in verse
1 it is not expedient for me doubtless to glory referring to the contents of
chapter 11 but then he says I will come to visions and revelations of the Lord
so he's going to get on a new subject about visions and revelations of the
Lord he's gonna tie that back to what he was talking about in chapter 11 says
in verse 2 I knew a man in Christ above 14 years ago whether in the body I
cannot tell or whether out of the body I cannot tell God know it such a one
caught up to the third heaven and I knew such a man whether in the body or out of
the body I cannot tell God know it how that he was caught up in paradise and
unspeakable words which it is not lawful for a man to utter of such a one will I
glory yet of myself I will not glory but in my infirmities now when you see those
two parentheses that say whether in the body I cannot tell or whether out of the
body I cannot tell God know it in both cases they're both pointing us to the
fact that he knew a man okay so he's not saying he doesn't know whether the guy
was caught up to heaven bodily or in spirit it seems to be that he's saying I
knew a man of Christ about 14 years ago and I don't know if I knew this guy or
came to know this guy or met this guy or interacted with this guy in the body or
out of the body God know it because it says again in verse 3 I knew such a man
whether in the body you're out of the body I cannot tell God knows what does
he mean by that he's saying he doesn't know whether this actually happened or
whether it was just a vision that he had or some kind of a spiritual revelation
that he had because of course even John the Apostle John he was shown a lot of
things in the book of Revelation but he was actually in spirit he didn't
literally physically go to those places but it was all in spirit and and so when
he says here I knew a man whether in the body or out of the bike he doesn't know
whether this was some kind of a spiritual experience where a spirit was
caught up and he saw these things or whether he actually literally had this
conversation okay which that's a little bit hard for us to understand right away
because we haven't had those type of revelations okay now there's a lot of
debate about this path whether the Apostle Paul is talking about someone
else or whether he's talking about himself typically when I've heard this
preached throughout my life preachers would say that he's actually referring
to himself that he's the man that was caught up to the third heaven he was
caught up into paradise and and heard these amazing things and saw amazing
things and what I've heard people say is that well it was actually him but he's
just being humble here by referring to himself in the third person as someone
else okay that doesn't make any sense to me because that doesn't fit the context
he's not being humble in this context because were you here for chapter 11 I
mean in chapters 10 11 12 and 13 he is ripping the Corinthians hard okay it's
very negative very caustic and I mean in chat by chapter 13 he's saying you need
to examine yourselves whether you're even saved and and you might even be
reprobates okay so he's preaching really hard so this wouldn't really be a time
for him to just be humble by acting like oh it was somebody else but it was
really me and he's just especially because if you look at verse 5 he says
of such and one will I glory yet of myself I will not glory so if he's
sitting there say well I'm not gonna glory myself I'm gonna glory of such a
one as that guy that was caught up the guy that I knew 14 years ago whether it
was in the body or out of the body I cannot tell God know it the only way
that this could possibly referring be referring to Paul himself being the one
who was caught up is if he's being very sarcastic in verse number five and being
just and that's not my interpretation I want to tell you right now I'm gonna
take this at face value I believe it was another person I'm just gonna take what
say he knew a man and this guy was caught up to heaven and this guy told
him these things and gave him these revelations from what he saw and heard
when he was there so I'm gonna take it as face value that is the third person
but if it were the Apostle Paul then he would he would have to be very
sarcastic in verse five to say well if such a one why glory yet of myself I
will not glory now there is a lot of sarcasm in this passage if you remember
in chapter 11 he's very negative he's being very angry with the Corinthians
and he uses sarcasm in fact in this chapter he uses some serious sarcasm
jump down to verse 13 for what is it wherein you were inferior to other
churches except it be that I myself was not burdensome to you forgive me this
wrong now that is sarcasm right oh please forgive me for not burdening you
you he's not actually saying oh would you please forgive me that I didn't
burden you that I wasn't a pain in the neck forgive me for doing that he's you
be sarcastic right look at verse 15 will see some more sarcasm and I will
very gladly spend it be spent for you though the more abundantly I love you
the less I be loved sees mad right he's rebuking him hard look what he says in
verse 16 but be it so I did not burden you nevertheless being crafty I caught
you with guile he's saying boy I was so tricky wasn't I I was so crafty I caught
you with guile did I make a gain of you by them whom I sent unto you I desire
Titus and with him I sent a brother did Titus make a gain of you walked we not
in the same spirit walked me not in the same step so he's being sarcastic oh
yeah right I was being really crafty I was really deceptive right because I
ripped you off right no actually I did it I was not a burden to you I did not
make a gain of you Titus not making any of you so you have to get the context of
this passage he's rebuking them hard he's angry with them it's a very stern
correction all the way from chapter 10 11 12 13 that's why it doesn't make
sense that he's just throwing in throwing out this anecdote and being
humble about it or you know the interpretation I've heard it doesn't
really fit the passage I I'm just gonna take it at face value that he's just
talking about a third person but if you really want to believe that this is the
Apostle Paul that's caught up you'd have to believe he's just being
sarcastic when he says well all glory in that guy but I wouldn't glory myself
because I'm nobody I'm nothing you know I mean a guy who had that experience
would really be somebody you know so it'd be like more sarcasm rebuking them
but again I think that that's a possibility but I I don't think that
that's correct so anyway now that we got the hardest part out of the way now
let's do some of the easy stuff in the chapter okay so he says here that this
man the Bible says in verse 2 was caught up to the third heaven now what
does that mean the third heaven well because there are three things in the
Bible that are called heaven first of all the sky is called heaven just the
atmosphere of the clouds and the Bible talks about the birds flying in the
heaven the birds flying in the open firmament of heaven so we have just the
sky being called heaven but then also what we know is outer space is also
called heaven in the Bible because the Bible talks about the Sun Moon and stars
being in the firmament of heaven so basically you have the sky being called
heaven and then you have what we know in our modern vernacular is outer space
being called heaven and then we have the place where God lives being called
heaven that would be the third heaven right it'd be beyond those other two
levels of quote-unquote heaven now you say well I don't like that term outer
space it's unbiblical oh really because the Bible says in Job that God stretches
out that the heavens over the empty place and he hangs the earth on nothing
right so the Bible mentions the empty place guess what that means space
something that's empty is space so space is a biblical term because it's called
the empty place and it says that the earth is hanging on nothing right
because we know it's it's not literally set up on something or hanging on
something it's just floating in space what we know to be true so anyway it
says that he was caught up to the third heaven and then it says in verse 4 how
he was caught up into paradise so this shows us that when the Bible refers to
paradise it's referring to the third heaven right because these two are being
used interchangeably he's caught up to paradise he's got up into the third
heaven now there's a doctrine out there that teaches that paradise is like an
Old Testament holding tank for the Saints before Christ died because they
couldn't go to heaven yet because Jesus hadn't died on the cross yet so they had
to go to this holding tank called paradise there's in the center of the
earth is right next to hell it was like hell and paradise both in the center
who's heard of that doctrine before okay well here's the problem with that the
word paradise is only used three times in the Bible none of them is in the Old
Testament so if this is supposedly the Old Testament location that's kind of
funny that it's never mentioned in the Old Testament and then it's kind of
funny that it's only mentioned three times in the New Testament and these are
the three mentions in the New Testament first of all Jesus said to the thief on
the cross today shalt thou be with me in paradise okay then we have this mention
where it says that he was caught up not down he was caught up into the third
heaven up into paradise saying that paradise is where up or down saying that
it's up and then the Bible says in Revelation chapter 2 to him to
overcome it will I give to eat of the tree of life which is in the midst of
the paradise of God those are the only three times this is mentioned so how can
you take those three mentions and then derive this doctrine oh yeah paradise is
down really cuz it's only three mentions and one of them says it's up the other
two don't talk about where it is they just talk about a saved guy is gonna go
there and then they talk about the fact that there's the tree of life they're
located in that place and of course we know that heaven is a place with with
trees and water and and fountains and animals and you know things like that so
we shouldn't really surprise us that the tree of life is in the midst of the
paradise of God because paradise is just another word for heaven right in the way
it's being used in the New Testament so the Bible says and by the way people in
the Old Testament when they died if they were saved they went to heaven they
didn't go to the hole they went straight to heaven they went all the way to
heaven and people say well no they couldn't go there cuz Jesus and I Jesus
is the lamb slain from the foundation of the world it's not like they had to
wait in a holding tank to make sure Jesus is really gonna go through with it
okay Jesus Christ sacrifice on the cross although it happened 2,000 years ago was
as good as done from the foundation of the world because God already promised
eternal life from the foundation of the world and God is so trustworthy of
keeping his promises if he says he's gonna do it he's gonna do it and the
fact that God dwells outside of time from his perspective everything has
already happened it's all done he steps back and just sees the whole picture so
even in the Old Testament Jesus Christ from God's perspective had already died
on the cross because he's the lamb slain from the foundation of the world as
God's outside of time so to say well they had to go to the holding tank as
Jesus hadn't died yet well then how did Enoch go straight to heaven I mean Enoch
walked with God and he was not for God took him so if nobody can go how did he
not go why did why did the chariot come down and pick up Elijah and take Elijah
straight up to heaven if nobody can go so the Bible talks about in Ecclesiastes
the spirit of the beast going downward into the earth and it talks about the
spirit of man that goes upward and the Bible says that the spirit will return
to God that gave it so when a man dies in the Old Testament be saved his spirit
returns to the Lord his spirit goes upward there's plenty of evidence that
people went to heaven in the Old Testament and that they they were not in
a place of death right you know the Bible says Abraham rejoiced to see my
day and was glad right so Abraham was able to observe Jesus Christ as
ministry who's seeing these things from heaven and rejoicing in Christ ministry
and so forth he wasn't deep in the earth in a holding tank okay the only
thing deep in the earth is hell it's all it's all fire and brimstone etc and you
say well you know what about that story of the rich man and Lazarus oh okay well
read the story there's a great gulf fixed there was a huge gap between hell
and heaven now a lot of people just they picture this as a physical literal just
normal everyday thing like people in hell are just hanging out with people in
paradise like like all day you're just listening to people screaming for a
drink of water all day well that would get old pretty fast okay it's a
supernatural story the people that are in hell are actually in darkness they
don't they don't just look at Abraham all day and just look at Lazarus all day
and they're not just constantly and it's just like good night how many times I
can have the same conversation where Abraham just has to give them all the
same speech or something and if there's this great goal between them how can
they even talk how can they even be heard above all the screaming and
wailing and everything like that right so you can't just take this as oh yeah
there's a great goal of it's just it's just like here's hell here's paradise
there's a goal it's just right there folks the story is talking about
something that took place miraculously where God miraculously allowed this
interaction to take place just as an illustration he's just showing us what
hell's like so he allows this one-time conversation to take place just so that
we can understand okay this is what hell's like people are burning they want
water there's fire they can't go to heaven people from heaven can't go to
them so guess where the great Gulf is you're in the great Gulf right now the
Gulf between heaven and hell okay so God allowed this conversation to take place
across the Gulf from heaven to hell but this isn't just a normal thing like
people in paradise are just down in the earth just hanging out watching people
burn in hell or something that's not biblical so you don't want to just take
the story of Luke chapter 16 and just turn the rest of the Bible on its head
the rest of Bible talking about save people going to heaven unsaved people
burning in hell darkness gnashing of teeth center of the earth heart of the
earth down into hell up to heaven and get this doctrine of oh well heavens
actually you know down there in the Old Testament wrong it's you know it doesn't
make any sense so and then other people will object by saying well why did Jesus
tell the guy today shalt thou be with me in paradise when he's on the cross you
know if Jesus is going to hell for three days and three nights then why would he
say today shall thou be with me in paradise well here's the thing about
that when he tells that to the thief he's telling the thief that the thief's
going to a good place obviously that was supposed to be comforting when he said
hey we're both going down to a fiery place today buddy no he said today
you'll be with me in paradise you'll be with me in paradise right so that was a
good place that he's gonna go now did Jesus go to a good place for three days
and three nights no because Jesus when he descended into the lower lower part
of the earth he said that he wants to get out of there his hope was that his
soul would not be left in hell neither his flesh secret Jesus went to hell for
three days and three nights and his hope was that he's not going to be left there
he knew that the Lord is faithful that he's gonna get out of there he's gonna
be resurrected and so that was the hope he's not hanging out in paradise it's
not like Jesus died on the cross and then went hung out in paradise for
three days no he's in hell for three days and he wants to get out of there
and he's looking forward to getting out of there that's what the Bible actually
says okay now today shalt thou be with me in paradise what's he talking about
well here's what we have to understand is that again God dwells outside of time
now the Bible when it talks about people burning in hell in Revelation 14 it says
that they will be tormented with fire and brimstone in the presence of the
holy angels and in the presence of the lamb and that's even referring to the
lake of fire the final location of hell he says they'll be tormented in the
presence of the lamb now are we expected to believe that the lamb Jesus Christ
because the lamb is not referring to God the Father or the Holy Spirit I mean the
lamb is Jesus are we supposed to believe that Jesus just just he just only hangs
out at that lake of fire and that's the only place that he is because he's just
got to be there to just kind of supervise everybody who's burning in the
lake of fire no obviously if the Bible tells us that people are going to be
tormented in the presence of the holy angels and in the presence of the lamb
that tells me that Jesus Christ can both be there at the lake of fire where they
could be tormented in his presence and he can also be seated at the right hand
of the Father at the same time okay because of the fact that he's God he
transcends things like time etc not only that but I believe that when Jesus
Christ went to hell for three days and three nights I believe that he suffered
an eternity of hell in three days of three nights because he transcends time
and my authority for that if you would flip back to Jonah chapter number two
Jesus Christ said as Jonah was three days and three nights in the whale's
belly so shall the Son of Man be three days and three nights in the heart of
the earth so Jesus compares himself to Jonah and talks about how Jonah's in the
whale and how he's gonna be in the heart of the earth what's the heart of the
earth the heart is the core the heart is the center of something okay so Jesus is
saying he's gonna be at the center of the earth the heart of the earth for
three days and three nights well look what the Bible says in Jonah chapter 2
verse 1 then Jonah prayed unto the Lord is God out of the fish's belly and said
I cried by reason of mind affliction unto the Lord and he heard me out of the
belly of hell cried I and thou heardest my voice now let me ask this was Jonah
literally in hell no Jonah was where he's in the belly of the whale but yet
he says out of the belly of hell cried I why because he's actually prophesying
about Jesus so he's talking about his own situation but then he's actually
prophesying about Jesus remember when the Ethiopian eunuch is talking to
Philip and he's reading Isaiah and he asked Philip is this prophet is he
talking about himself or is he talking about another man okay why because
sometimes the prophets when they're talking about themselves are actually
prophesying about Christ like when David says my god my god why is thou forsaken
me when he says they pierced my hands and my feet did that really happen to
David did David get his hands and feet pierced no Jesus is gonna get his hands
and feet pierced so he says they pierced my hands and my feet in Psalm 22 about
Jesus in Psalm 16 when David says thou wilt not leave my soul in hell neither
wilt thou suffer that holy one to see corruption that's interpreted in Acts
chapter 2 as hey David saw corruption David was not talking about himself
there the acts 231 says this spake he of the resurrection of Christ that his soul
was not left in hell neither did his flesh see corruption so Isaiah David
Jonah when they're preaching or prophesying often they're not talking
about themselves they're actually talking about Jesus okay well here in
Jonah chapter 2 Jonah is talking about his own situation but he's actually
prophesying about Jesus and then Jesus is going to point back to this and say
hey this is a picture this is a sign of the Prophet Jonah that as Jonah was
three days and three nights in the whale's belly so shall the Son of Man be
three days and three nights are there so he said I cried by reason of mine
affliction unto Lord verse 2 and he heard me out of the belly of hell cried I
and thou heardest my voice for thou has cast me into the deep now it was Jonah
thrown into the deep yeah he was thrown into the deep water and he got
swallowed by a whale in the midst of the seas is that Jonah yeah he's in the sea
the floods compass me about that's Jonah all thy billows and thy waves passed
over me that's Jonah then I said I'm cast out of thy sight yet I will look
again toward thy holy temple the waters compass me about even to the soul right
this all applies to Jonah the depths closed me roundabout the weeds were
wrapped about my head so you can picture Jonah he's swallowed by the whale the
whales been eating a bunch of seaweed he's got a bunch of season the stomach
of the whale wrapped up in a bunch of seaweed and you say well I just don't
think it's humanly possible for a man to live in the belly of a whale but the
Bible says that God prepared a great whale to swallow Jonah so God actually
prepared a special whale to be able to swallow Jonah where he could exist in
the whale's belly for three days even though obviously it was uncomfortable
and miserable it was a hellish experience picturing hell it pictured
hell priest by burning up and stomach acid in there but it was you know it was
bad I'm sure it was very miserable that's why when he got out of the
whale's belly man he was ready to straighten up and fly right he's like
what do you want to do you know I mean he was he couldn't get there fast enough
to Nineveh okay but look what it says the weeds were wrapped about my head
that's literal but look at verse six I went down to the bottoms of the
mountains Jonah didn't do that the earth with her bars was about me forever about
me means around me okay around and about are synonymous so he's saying look the
earth with her bars was around me or about me forever now did Jonah go
anywhere forever he's only there for three days did he go down to the bottoms
of the mountains no he went in deep water but he didn't go to the bottoms of
the mountains was the earth surrounding him where the earth and and her bars
around him or about him forever no but this is going back to when he said out
of the belly of hell cried I prophesying about Jesus Jesus went to hell for three
days and three nights the Bible tells in Ephesians 4 that Jesus descended into
the lower parts of the earth and so Jesus went down to the bottoms of the
mountains you know obviously not his body but his soul was in hell for three
days and three nights he went down to the bottoms of mountains and the earth
with her bars was around him or about him forever I believe what that's
indicating is that he suffered a forever of hell in a finite period of time
because he's God so he can transcend the normal rules of time and space that we
would typically be familiar with just like where Jesus after he is risen from
the dead they have all the doors shut but yeah he just enters the room without
anybody opening the door okay obviously he's transcending space and time there
so anyway we see here that the earth with her bars was about me forever yet
as thou brought up my life from corruption O Lord my God and on and on
it goes so if you would flip over to Ephesians chapter 4 Ephesians 4 I got to
cover a few more things in 2nd Corinthians 12 so I don't want to spend
the whole night on this but I kind of opened this can of worms so I have to
see it through to its completion here so Ephesians chapter 4 says in verse 8
wherefore he saith when he ascended up on high he led captivity captive and
gave gifts unto men now that he ascended what is it but that he also descended
first into the lower parts of the earth so Jesus descended first into the lower
parts of the earth that's when he went down to hell for three days three nights
and then later he us ends to be seated at the right hand of the Father now this
phrase captivity captive is an abused phrase people who believe in this
paradise Abraham's bosom Old Testament holding tank doctrine what they'll say
is that well when he led captivity captive that's when he took all the
saved people that were in the holding tank and moved them all to heaven now
here's the thing about that if that really happened if millions and millions
of saved people were in a holding tank in the earth and then Christ is just
gonna do this mass transplant of just moving millions of millions of people to
heaven don't you think the Bible would talk about that somewhere or explain
that I mean that that seems like a big event I remember I was listening to a
preacher one time preaching and he started kind of teaching that doctrine
about how they moved them all and he's like man we don't talk enough about that
we don't preach enough about that it's like because you want me scripture where
do you what chapter do you turn to describe that magnificent event where
millions and millions and millions of souls are released from paradise it's
like well I don't know it's paradise can we stay you know but it's like oh we
got you know they're all their captives they're in prison it's like well if
you're gonna be in prison might as well be paradise amen paradise isn't prison
prison isn't paradise these don't make any sense folks but they say oh you know
they let out the he let out the million souls and and millions and millions of
people all the Old Testament saved got relocated heaven wouldn't the Bible
described I mean that's a big event like think about how big the rapture is
but there's a whole bunch of scripture that we could point to on on Christ
coming the clouds the trumpet sounding we go to Matthew 24 we go to mark 13 we
go to Luke 21 we could go to Revelation chapter 7 we could go to Revelation 14
we could talk about it in 1st Corinthians chapter 15 you know we could
point to a bunch of verses that describe that type of event here's what they've
got well he led captivity captive now first of all this also shows a lack of
understanding about what the term captivity captive means because they'll
say will that mean that's when he did that but if we actually compare
scripture with scripture the Bible uses this term led captivity captive back in
the book of Judges chapter 5 it says arise Oh Barak and lead thy captivity
captive okay what was going on that story where's the thing Barak and the
children of Israel were in bondage to a foreign power okay to Canaanite heathens
and what happened was Barak turned the tables on them and those who had kept
him captive he made them his captives so here Barak is under their authority and
he turns it around and he leads captivity captive does everybody
understand what I'm saying he was oppressed by the enemy and then he
turned around and became the one who had them on the run he had Sisera and Jabin
on the run does everybody understand okay so what does it mean when the Bible
says that Christ led captivity captive it says in verse 8 of chapter 4 in
Ephesians wherefore he says when he ascended up on high he led captivity
captive and then it says in verse 9 now that he ascended what is it but that he
also descended first so here's what it means when it says Jesus led captivity
captive Jesus Christ was captive in hell for three days and three nights Jesus
Christ is in a place that's known as a prison it's known as a bad place he's
his resting and hope is that he's not gonna be left there so Jesus Christ is
in hell and then what does he do he leads captivity captive he resurrects
from hell but not only that this is what he said I have the keys of hell and of
death so that's how he turned around the place that held him captive now he is
the master of that place he has the keys he said I'm he that liveth and was dead
and behold I'm alive forevermore amen and have the keys of hell and of death
now here's the thing about that they say well you know Jesus was just an Abraham's
bosom for three days and three nights that's not called being dead
so yeah it is no it isn't because Jesus said I'm the God of Abraham and the God
of Isaac and the God of Jacob God is not the God of the dead but of the living so
when Jesus was walking on this earth was Abraham dead the Bible says no that's
why Jesus said Abraham rejoiced to see my day and was glad why because Abraham
was alive Isaac was alive Jacob was alive he said God's not the God of the
dead but of the living Abraham Isaac and Jacob are alive so let me ask you this
if Jesus was an Abraham bosom for three days and three nights was he dead or
alive he'd be alive then if he's with Abraham Abraham's alive folks that's
wrong Jesus was dead for three days and three nights and guess where dead people
go dead people go to hell hell is called death hell is the place of the dead it
is the place of death the people that are in hell right now are called dead
that's why the Bible says that death and hell delivered up the dead which were in
them so people that are in heaven are they dead they're alive people that are
in hell are dead so where was Jesus for three days and three nights in the place
where people are alive or the place where people are dead he was dead for
three days and three nights and then he rose again from the dead okay not only
that go to Romans 10 Romans chapter 10 so a lot of people say well Jesus didn't
go to hell for three days and three nights well then what do you do with acts
231 acts 231 says this bakey of the resurrection of Christ that his soul was
not left in hell so what's the resurrection it's that his soul was not
left in hell his soul came out of hell well but hell doesn't really mean hell
there okay well are there any other verses that you want to just change or
any other words that you want to just redefine while we're at it because every
time the word hell is used in the Bible it's a bad place it's a place where
people don't want to go you say well you know it's Hades well you know not in my
King James Bible but I guess you're probably a lot smarter than the 54 King
James translators you're probably a lot smarter than the translators of all the
other Bible versions throughout history that have said hell here right he said
oh it's Hades okay well guess what Hades is a bad place too okay because guess
what if you look up every time the word Hades is used in the Greek guess what
it's a bad place it's hell right okay let's say we just wanted to call it
Hades okay in Hades he lift up his eyes being in torments you got a guy in flames
begging for a drop of water in Hades okay so what's the difference folks but
what they do is they want to come at you with a foreign language so that they can
just trick you it's to distract you oh well the Greek says this it's a
distraction tactic it's like a magician you know get you to look over here and
then he pulls the card out from his sleeve or whatever so they basically
come at you and say well you know he didn't go to hell he went to Hades see
if we actually looked up all the verses about hell slash Hades guess what you're
gonna find out it's bad none of them are good there's no good Hades or good hell
cold hell it isn't there folks it's a hot place okay and by the way in Greek
mythology they believe that everybody went to Hades and it was a bad place
there's a negative place that nobody wanted to go but they they said we're
all going there well guess what they were right they were all going there
because guess what if you don't believe on if you don't believe on Jehovah God
and you're believing in Zeus and everybody else you are going to go to
Hades you are going straight to hell and they said oh it's a dark underworld
place it's a bad place it's not it's better to be alive being alive is better
than being down in Hades because it's dark and miserable down there or
whatever and they had obviously weird beliefs about what's down there but none
of it wasn't a good place and you know what they were right everybody was going
there amongst them amongst them that believed in that stuff all their buddies
were going to Hades right so that's why Jesus and the Apostles they use that
word to describe hell because it's a dark place of punishment under the earth
and here's the thing our English word hell comes from Scandinavian folklore
about a dark underworld look pagans all over the world have always believed in
like this dark underworld fiery place cuz it's real cuz it's there okay you
say well you know they're just a bunch of pagans that made up a bunch of crazy
stuff well you know what yeah they made up a bunch of gods and goddesses except
guess what those are real too they're called demons and all the Hindu gods
those are real too they're called demons they're called devils folks hey look the
idols nothing but God says when they worship an idol they're worshiping a
demon that's what the Bible says so therefore you know you can't wiggle out
of this my friend when the Bible says that his soul was not left in hell okay
that's what it's saying folks is that his soul was not left in hell unless you
just want to just make the whole Bible just up for grabs and go join the Bible
of the Month Club and you can get the NIV and the ESV and the New American
Standard hey we're King James only folks what the Bible says in the King James
Bible is what we believe the truth to be okay and don't let people try to spin
your head with a foreign language but look at Romans chapter 10 and the Bible
says in verse 6 but the righteousness which is a faith speak of on this why
say not in thine heart who shall ascend into heaven that is to bring Christ down
from above or who shall descend into the deep that is to bring up Christ again
from the dead so when Christ was dead where was he he was in the deep he was
in the abyss right he was in the bottomless pit is where he was he was in
hell for three days and three nights and this term the deep you know you'll find
this elsewhere in Scripture it's failing me right now maybe somebody out there
knows what I'm talking about I want to say it's in the book of Luke but in one
of the Gospels where the the the one that is demon possessed and he's
speaking to them and they're saying that they don't want to go to the deep
somebody got an electronic gadget they can find that verse for me isn't there
a verse like that where you'd say they say hey don't we don't want to go to the
deep what is it no that's that's something different that's not what I'm
talking about don't just start in Genesis and read me all the deep verses
let's narrow that search okay what is it Luke 831 let me sorry this isn't in
my notes because I don't have any notes but anyway Luke Luke excuse me
Luke chapter 831 says or let's start in verse 30 and Jesus asked him saying what
is thy name and he said Legion because many devils were entered into him and
they besought him that he would not command them to go out into the deep
they're like we don't want to go to the deep that's where Christ was when he was
dead for three is three nights the deep okay the lower parts of the earth the
deep the abyss the pit hell the Bible is consistent on this point I don't care if
it's out of fashion this is what the Bible teaches okay and elsewhere the
demons say to him torment us not before the time and then in this parallel
passage they say don't send us out into the deep okay so anyway I spent way too
much time on that but it's it's an important point it's good to cover go to
2nd Corinthians chapter 12 now some people though when they learn this
doctrine which if you're gonna if you're gonna believe the Bible and take it for
what it actually says in the King James Bible you would have to say Jesus went
to hell for three days three nights because that's where it says he went in
acts 231 unless you're gonna try to go back to the Greek and even if you go
back to the Greek you know you're still just gonna come right back around and
say okay you know he's in hell okay because it's just it doesn't matter what
like we can do it in Spanish if you want you know do it wherever the language but
the point is that some people when they learn this they'll go overboard and say
like if you don't believe this you're not saved you have to believe in this
you know to be saved you have to believe Jesus was in hell for three days and
three nights to be saved that isn't true because what we have to believe in to be
saved is we have to believe in the death burial and resurrection of Christ let me
ask you this was his body buried or was it his soul that was buried it's the
body that was buried so when the Bible says the death burial and resurrection
that's what we have to believe to be saved is that Jesus Christ died and that
he was buried and that he rose again so if somebody believes that his soul was
was in hell as the Bible teaches correctly or if they have a wrong belief
that his soul was you know packing everybody up for the big trip from
paradise to heaven okay they're still saved if they believe either of those
things as long as they believe in the bodily resurrection of Christ now the
Jehovah's Witnesses are not saved because they do not believe in the bodily
resurrection that's the key component folks the bodily resurrection of Christ
the Jehovah's Witnesses say well this is a spiritual resurrection well that's not
a resurrection they say well his soul left his body yeah that's called dying
right giving up the ghost okay no it's the body without the spirits dead what
the resurrection is is that Jesus Christ came out of the grave and showed them
the holes in his hands and the holes in his and the hole in his side that's the
resurrection we need to believe in to be saved so if people are mixed up on this
doctrine if people you know have gotten this Abraham's bosom thing or and they
don't realize that Abraham's bosom is a body part not a place okay and that at
his bosom means he's got his arm around him it doesn't mean he's like inside of
his chest cavity or something or like and here's the thing if they're all
going inside of his chest cavity where did he go where whose cavity is he
inside of so you know people are just being crazy when the Bible says that you
know Lazarus is is there and Abraham or Abraham is there and Lazarus in his
bosom this simply means here come here Solomon this is what means if Solomon is
in my bosom this is him in my bosom all right you see that this is my bosom all
right you know this is my chest right Illuminati confirmed right here folks
okay but anyway you know when the Bible talks about pluck your hand out of your
bosom okay it's talking about the chest area this is your bosom everybody
understand that okay so if I have somebody in my bosom that's what it
means right there I've got my arm around them and that's what when John leaned on
Jesus bosom he's leaning on his chest right he's leaned up against him at the
Last Supper he's got his arm around him or he's leaned up against him asking him
who the betrayer or who the traitor was okay so that's what it means to be in
Abraham's bosom it just means basically that he was just standing next to
Abraham and Abraham's got his arm around him it's not hard to understand but
they've created a place called Abraham's bosom that's not a place people to me
like maybe this is stupid but when I first heard this place Abraham's bosom
it to me it sounded like a weird name for like a bar or something you know
like bars have these really weird names that don't make sense I just picture
like a neon flashing light Abraham's bosom it's like you know the where
people go to hang out or something folks that doesn't make any sense that's not
that's not what you name a place and when things don't make sense it's
usually because they're not true that's why they don't make any sense all right
so anyway all right that was this is gonna be a long night no I'm just kidding
I'm just I'm just gonna point out a couple other things in the chapter and
here's the thing you know chapter 12 is really a lot more of the same as what we
had in chapter 11 so the fact that I'm not going verse by verse through the
whole chapter he's pretty much just continuing the face ripping from chapter
11 he rips on him he's angry he's using some sarcasm he's telling him off so
let's hit some more highlights here so this guy was caught up to the third
heaven he was caught up not down up to paradise and we should base what we
believe on what the Bible says not on what it doesn't say we got three verses
mentioning paradise they're all in the New Testament and they say it's up but
then you're gonna tell me no paradise is the Old Testament place and it's down
you didn't get that from reading the Bible because there's only three verses
and none of them teach that all right so that was all that was just for the first
four verses so he says in verse five of such a one while I glory yet of myself I
will not glory but in my infirmities for though I would desire to glory I shall
not be a fool for I will say the truth but now I forbear list any man should
think of me above that which he see of me to be or that he heareth of me what's
he saying here he's saying look I would desire to glory you know there's a part
of us as human beings human nature that wants to boast or to glory or to brag
but he's saying I would desire to glory but I shall not be a fool and if you
remember last week we talked about when you brag and boast and glorify yourself
you sound like an idiot right when you're bragging and and prideful you
sound stupid and he's saying I don't want to be a fool by bragging and
glorying and he says in verse seven lest I should be exalted above measure
through the abundance of the revelations like for example this revelation where
this guy who was caught up to heaven told him about what he saw up there he
says there was given to me a thorn in the flesh the messenger of Satan to
buffet me lest I should be exalted above measure for this thing I besought the
Lord thrice that it might depart from me and he said to me my grace is sufficient
for thee for my strength is made perfect and weakness most gladly therefore will
I rather glory in my infirmities that the power of Christ may rest upon me
therefore I take pleasure in infirmities now what's he saying here he's saying
that because he had such an abundance of revelations and remember we're talking
about the man who pen down 14 books of the New Testament half the books of the
New Testament are written by the Apostle Paul right everything from Romans to the
epistle of Paul the apostles of the Hebrews as it says in the 1611 replica
back there everything from Romans to Hebrews is written by the Apostle Paul
that's an abundance of revelations now Paul said that because of that abundance
of revelations there could be a tendency for people to put him on too high of a
pedestal to exalt him too much and it could go to his head right I mean when
you're writing 14 books of the Bible that could go to your head you when
you're used more by God than any other apostle than any other preacher you know
arguably in the history of Christianity then that could go to your head right so
because of that God gave him a thorn in the flesh so that he wouldn't be exalted
above measure something bad to keep him humble and three times he asked God to
remove this thorn in the flesh and God would not remove it and he says you know
I'd rather have a thorn in the flesh I'd rather be weak and have this infirmity
and have the power of Christ rest upon me I'd rather have the revelations and
the power of God and the power of Christ and put up with this thorn in my flesh
it's just the price that you pay for serving God is what he's saying here now
this is how our lives are going to be as well God doesn't want us to be prideful
or puffed up and so sometimes God has to take us down notch he might have to keep
us financially a little bit leaner than we want to be or he could send physical
ailments a literal thorn in the flesh right and living in Arizona we know
about the thorn in the flesh who is who has had a literal thorn in your flesh
since you've lived here yeah pretty much everybody you know I I walk around and
run around a lot barefoot I've lit I mean I guess God's just trying to keep
me humble because I've had hundreds of burrs in my foot over the years where
you step on a burr and it stabs you and you have to pull it out you know who
knows what I'm talking about those little goats heads yeah they are demonic
is what they are but you know you get these little goats head stuck in your
foot or thorns cactus needles I mean if you live here long enough you're gonna
get all of it if you spend any time outside okay well God gave him a thorn
in the flesh we don't know what that is people have speculated about this over
the years they said hey maybe it was bad eyesight you know because he talked
about how people would have plucked out their own eyes and given them to him
because they loved him so much or maybe it was this maybe it was that maybe it
was just the fact that he talks about in this passage about you know not being a
great speaker and so but it was probably more like a physical ailment I think
that God purposely doesn't tell us what it was because he wants us to be able to
apply it to our life because we you know whatever our thorn in the flesh if it
was a specific thing then we might look at that and say well I can't relate
because my thorn in the flesh is totally different than what Paul had so I think
he wants to leave it generic so that you can apply it to your life maybe your
thorn in the flesh is a disease that you have maybe you have some kind of a
handicap or some kind of a I don't know is that even politically correct even
say that anymore you know maybe you're challenged or special but you know you
know maybe you have some kind of a physical handicap a physical ailment
whether it's a disease maybe you're lame that's probably not a bad that's
probably a bad thing to say now maybe you're crippled you know maybe you're
maybe you're blind maybe you're deaf maybe you are whatever dumb you know and
I mean like dumb like you can't speak these are Bible words folks you know
whatever your ailment maybe you have diabetes or maybe you have asthma or
maybe you you know walk with a limp or whatever I mean look I bet you wish that
you didn't have that right whatever your physical I'm you know I have a finger
that pops out of joint every day and it's annoying it hurts it bugs me
sometimes I I literally just think to myself someday I may have to just chop
off this finger so that it stops popping out of joint I'm not gonna do it but
sometimes it starts hurting so much and I start thinking like man do I just need
to you know if I write finger a Fendi just cut it off you know and I'm I'm not
gonna do it folks but I'm just saying cuz it'll just keep bugging me and
hurting it's just like we're gone but then you hear about people who get limbs
amputated it hurts anyway they have like a phantom pain from where their limb
used to be so that's not the answer but anyway you know I have I have this
probably my worst thing is I have this problem with my throat that caused me to
choke on my food almost every day so I just am constantly choking all the time
just choking like literally a couple weeks ago I I had something stuck in my
throat and I'm not talking about eating big pieces of steak or something I'm
talking about my esophagus is is like a soda straw a small soda straw in size
literally so I have to chew my food really well and wash it down and so
stuff gets stuck in my throat all the time I literally a couple weeks ago had
something stuck in my throat for over an hour and I was just throwing up for over
an hour trying to get this thing out of my throat is stuck in my throat and this
is some everyday every literally you are talking about praying for your food
you know I'm sitting there I don't just pray for my food once I'm praying with
every bite I'm like please don't let me choke don't choke don't choke don't
literally every bite of food I take I have to concentrate on not choking so
that I don't choke on my food okay and it's something my dad struggled with my
brother it's but they don't have it as bad as I do but it's something that has
gotten worse the older that I get and it just it's like the rest of my body grew
and my throat just stayed the same size or something so anyway you know this is
just like a nightmare it's a pain in the neck it's very embarrassing because
sometimes I'll be in a public place like I'll be a guest preacher somewhere or
I'm visiting somewhere and I'll be eating with people and all of a sudden I
just jump up and just run outside or jump up and run to the bathroom and they
don't know why I just jumped up and ran away and then sometimes they might hear
from the bathroom like vomiting sounds or sometimes I've been known to be just
literally by the side of the road you know or outside the restaurant in the
bushes on my knees throwing up for like 20 minutes and people probably think I'm
drunk you know especially a guy in a suit in the bushes outside a restaurant
throwing up they think man this guy you know happy hour started early for this
guy or something it's embarrassing it's humiliating to be with people and you're
throwing up puking and it's embarrassing right so you know I don't like that I
wish that I would be healed of that but you know what you're just gonna have
things like that in your life that maybe embarrass you sometimes or make you look
stupid or there or they just it's very painful to have something stuck in your
throat for an hour it hurts and all the acids coming up and everything like that
now thankfully it's not life-threatening because whenever I have something stuck
in my throat it never blocks my airway otherwise I would have been dead about
500 times so it's not life-threatening I've had stuff stuck in my throat for
two three hours before so the point is that you're gonna and you know okay I'm
just bringing up that illustration just to illustrate something to you but but I
guarantee you you've got other things maybe it's a it's a relationship
problem a financial problem a physical literal physical thorn in the flesh
which is probably what Paul's talking about some kind of a physical ailment
whatever these things are God allows us to have these things to keep us humble
let me just explain some to you and I'm gonna close on this point because this
is a key point let me just explain something to you let's say you grew up
and you went to school and you were good-looking popular healthy dressed
stylishly smart excelling in schoolwork excelling in sports everybody likes you
you're the prom king the prom queen the whatever the class president whatever
guess what you know what you know what you're gonna be a horrible person people
where just everything goes well for them they end up being bad people why because
suffering makes us a better person that's why David said it's good for me
that I've been afflicted that I might keep thy word so bad things happen to us
suffering sorry the Bible says through the sorrow of the countenance the heart
is made better so you know what let's say you look when I was growing up let
me let me just I'm telling you all my my my trials and tribulations my woes my
faults tonight you know when I was growing up look up until the city and
I'm sure people you know would love to use these things to make fun of me or
whatever but here's the thing from the time I was starting out school all the
way until I was around 11 I was the shortest kid in the class if you look at
my class picture it's me and a Filipino kid and a Mexican kid in the front super
short everybody else is tall and guess what those are my two best friends right
there okay you know the Filipino and the Mexican that were my height all right so
basically you know when I grew up I was the shortest kid in the class all the
way through sixth grade then seventh grade boom I shot up and now I'm a
normal white guy height of five ten and a half okay but when I was growing up I
was the shortest kid in the class that's not easy you know and then also when I
was a teenager I had horrible acne horrible acne like one of the worst
acne of people that I knew and at the time you wish that you were taller you
wish that you didn't have acne you wish XY and Z were different about yourself
but guess what if you were great looking and tall dark and handsome and smart and
excelling at everything and feeling great you'd be a horrible person okay
God uses these things to keep us humble so let's say you have acne guess what
that can keep you humble from going around thinking that you're just the
greatest person ever and you're so beautiful and you're so cool and
everything you know what it lets you know how other people feel they'd have
other problems with their appearance or issues you can develop empathy and not
just be somebody where everything goes perfect for them or maybe maybe you're
short or maybe you're you know overweight or you have acne or you're
bald or what I don't know whatever is wrong with you but anyway the point is
I'm just I'm just trying to see how many lines I can cross tonight of being
politically incorrect but the point is whatever is wrong with you tonight guess
what guess what that's how God made you God allowed you to be born short or
predisposition for your throat being way too small or or you know being too short
or have an acne or just whatever to go bald in your twenties or or whatever
happened to you right I mean I've seen people who got gray hair when they were
a teenager or in their 20s you see people go bald in their 20s like oh man
you know Oh Lord why did you do this to me so that you wouldn't be a jerk he's
making you a nice person because guess what when you go through life and you
have problems and you have faults you're not so high and mighty and it
makes you a humble person it makes you a better person makes you a nice person
makes you an empathetic person so all I'm saying is this I want you to be
encouraged tonight about your infirmities that's why Paul said all
glory in my infirmities say you know what you got to get to a point of
maturity in your life where you say praise God that I have acne praise God
that I was short praise God that I had that disease or praise God for my throat
or my finger or whatever is wrong with you because God does those things for a
reason God could have just snapped his fingers and made you different you say
well I'm ugly God made you ugly for a reason God wants you to be ugly okay you
know I remember one preacher said you know he hated being short his whole life
he actually had his fully grown height was like five two which is pretty short
for a man and he was like five two but he said you know what then I met my wife
and she was like five foot or five one or something and it was just like
perfect and he said you know maybe if I would have been tall I wouldn't ended up
with her but I ended up with her cuz it's like hey baby I'm short you're
short you know so he was happy that he was short hey God made me short great so
that I could basically you know hit it off with this woman that's gonna be my
wife gonna be a great wife great life great relationship so God has done the
things that he's done for a reason and so Paul is saying you know I wanted God
to remove the thorn from my flesh but he didn't because he's keeping me humble
well this isn't the Bible for a reason it's for us to learn from that and say
you know what God's keeping me humble he allowed me to get sick or to be weak so
that I could stay humble you know there are so many things in my life where I
felt like sometimes something's just working against me not allowing me to
succeed there was just a force working against me not allowing me to succeed
but then I look back at those things I'm like I'm glad I didn't succeed at that
because God had a different plan for me he had a different route from my life
if I would have succeeded here here or here or here then I wouldn't ended up
where I am now or relationships that failed because I'm supposed to be with
my wife and so yeah that's why those relationships failed they were supposed
to fail does everybody understand what I'm saying so these thorns in our flesh
rejoice in them be thankful for all things and don't get upset when you pray
to God to fix something he doesn't fix it if you pray to God and you in the
sincerity of your heart according to God's will you pray to the Lord and ask
him to do something for you and you love him and you keep his commandments and
you pray and he doesn't do it then it means that it's not supposed to happen
because he's either gonna do it for you if it's good for you or he knows that's
not good for you so I'm not gonna answer that prayer because I got something
better for you I've got a better plan okay so don't get depressed because
you're ugly or whatever because you're supposed to be ugly that was the plan
from before the foundation of the world and I'm being silly I'm I'm being and
honestly I am being facetious because I look around tonight I don't see anybody
who's ugly and I mean that from the bottom of my heart because you know what
I don't let Hollywood and Madison Avenue tell me what ugly means so I look around
and I see a bunch of beautiful people you know why because if you love God
you're a beautiful person and God made us all the way that we are we don't have
to try to look like someone else we have to try to be someone else because you
know what God made us the way that we are and the Bible says he's made all
things beautiful in his time and if we are fearfully and wonderfully made so
don't let the world tell you that you're ugly just because you are you know
modeling challenged or whatever you know because you're you're you're Madison
Avenue challenged your Hollywood challenged okay guess what I don't want
to look like the the the whoremongers of Hollywood I don't want to be some pretty
boy that's ready to be an NSYNC or the Backstreet Boys you know I you know what
I want to look like this is what I want to look like believe it or not I'm happy
with the way I look you know this is the way God made me this is who I am it is
what it is you know what I mean and and if people think that I look handsome or
ugly it doesn't really matter because you know what this is who God made me
and I just know this is the face I'm supposed to have for whatever reason and
whatever face you have that's the face that you're supposed to have for
whatever the reason okay you know and and and you know what I'm sure as I get
older I'm probably not gonna get better looking you know by the time I'm 60 70
80 I might start looking a little bit rough I don't know but you know what I'm
gonna be just as happy with the way I look when I'm 75 as I do now because
it's whatever God plan is now some people they modify their own appearance
and make themselves look goofy but the way that God made us okay you know I
can't vouch for mutilations that people do but you know the way God made us is
the way we're supposed to look and I and I look around and I see a bunch of
great-looking people today you're you look you you are you are just great
all right so I'm practicing being a TV preacher being really positive y'all
look so good tonight who is that an impression of quick all right very good
all right all right let's buy our dinner board of prayer that's a great place to
end the sermon all right dear Lord we thank you so much for everything you
give us Lord and Lord we even thank you for the thorns in the flesh the
infirmities although they're not fun and we we may spend time begging you to
remove physical ailments and problems Lord thank you for the problems that
I've had in my life because you've used them to make me grow as a Christian Lord
and I just pray that people would not get sad or depressed about physical
problems that they have but rather they would just understand that God can use
them if they're blind if they're deaf if they're if they're lame whatever it is
they can be used for your will and in heaven all those things will be fixed
and so thank you for your word and the encouragement and in Jesus name we pray
amen