Alright, we're here in 2 Thessalonians chapter 2 and the name of this sermon is
How to Prove a Post-Tribulation Rapture. How to Prove a Post-Tribulation Rapture.
And, you know, if you're not familiar with this church, you're going around maybe a
short time, our position on the rapture is that it's a post-tribulation slash free
rapture. Very dogmatic, this is our position, this is what we believe about
the rapture, okay? Now, if you're, if you haven't really studied the end times, you
don't necessarily know what you believe on that, I believe this sermon will show
you just bottom pretty clear, okay? But the point of the sermon is really that
you can learn how to teach other people this doctrine, okay? Because it's one thing
to know something, it's another thing to be able to actually teach it to
somebody else. Now, let me give you a reason why I'm coming up with a sermon
and I'm basically going to preach or teach the exact same thing I did several years ago
when I talked to my wife before we were married, because my wife watched After the
Tribulation two times, she was still pre-trib, and then I talked to her on the
phone and I just explained, you know, this verse, this passage, this passage, I was just out on the walk,
didn't have a Bible in front of me, but I was able to tell her where to turn to and
she just immediately said, that makes perfect sense, okay? The reason why there's so many
different beliefs is people are confused because there's a lot of false things
being said, and when they read the book of Revelation, they're like, man, I'm so
confused. Look, the Bible's not meant to be confusing. It's meant to be simple, it's meant to be
understandable, and when you hear something explained, if it's really
complicated, it's probably not true. Now, if it makes sense, then it's going to be like, okay, well, you know the Bible's meant to make sense? I believe that. It makes sense, okay? So when it comes to proving the post-Tribulation
rapture, I believe the first place you should turn is 2 Thessalonians 2, not
Matthew chapter 24. You say, why? Well, first I would say 2 Thessalonians 2, because it is just as clear as Matthew 24, but also because people have a memorized answer after the Tribulation, and the
preacher and crowd has heard that, and they have reasons why they're choosing to
reject Matthew 24. We'll look at that later on, but they've already heard that
argument, and so then when you say after the Tribulation, it's like, yeah, that's what you
say in Matthew 24. What you want to do is hit them where they do not expect you.
They expect you to turn to Matthew 24, but 2 Thessalonians 2 is just as
clear, and they don't expect that. So you hit them with something they do not
expect off of that. Now, let's look at 2 Thessalonians 2. Let's look at verse number 1.
Now, we beseech you, brethren, by the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ and by
our gathering together onto Him. Now, in the first verse, it's talking about
the Lord's coming back, the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ, and by our gathering
together onto Him. The gathering together onto Him, that's referring to the
Rapture, and so these two things are being linked together. His coming and
also the Rapture, our gathering together onto Him. What the preacher and
crowd likes to do is say that there's multiple comings, okay? You don't get that
context here from 2 Thessalonians 2, and it's going to contradict itself, but notice
how it says the coming and also the gathering. This is talking about when
people will be raptured. Notice what it says in verse number 2, that you be not
soon shaken in mind or be troubled. So basically, don't be worried, neither by
spirit nor by word nor by letter as from us as that the day of Christ is at hand.
What is he saying? He's saying it wasn't the Spirit of God, neither by Spirit. It's
not the Spirit of God. It's not the Word of God. It says, nor by word nor by letter
as from us. It's not an epistle that we wrote to you. So it's not the Spirit of
God. It's not the Word of God. It's not a letter from us as that the day of Christ
is at hand. What does it mean to be at hand? It means about to take place, and
he's saying, look, it wasn't the Spirit of God that told you that He could come in at
any moment. It wasn't the Word of God. It wasn't a letter from us as the day of
Christ is at hand. You say, well, how do you know it can't come at any moment?
Well, notice what it says in verse number 3. Let no man deceive you by any means, for that day
shall not come, except there come a fall in the way first, and that man of sin be
revealed in the Son of tradition. Look, the Bible says that day is not going to come
except first there must be a fall in the way, and the man of sin be revealed in the
Son of tradition. Now, look, both of these things must take place, the fall in the way
and the man of sin being revealed. Let me ask you a question. Who is the Antichrist?
If you don't know who the Antichrist is, which is the man of sin, then he's
obviously not revealed himself, because revealing is to make yourself known.
And nobody knows who the Antichrist is. And so if the Antichrist is not known, then Jesus cannot come back yet.
Why? That man of sin is revealed first. That must take place first. And unless he comes back first,
Jesus is not coming back. I hate to break your heart, but Jesus cannot come back before the end of the service.
It's not going to happen. The rapture can't just take place out of nowhere. No, the man of sin must be revealed first.
That's what the Bible says. Now, in this verse, it says, except there come a fall in the way first.
Now, believe it or not, I think 2 Thessalonians 2-3 is a very strong verse that proves it's not a creature of rapture.
This is actually one of their biggest arguments. You say, how in the world is 2 Thessalonians 2 verse 3 one of their biggest arguments
when it makes it clear that that day is coming, the gathering together, which are one event,
that that day is not going to come except there come a fall in the way first and that man of sin be revealed?
Now, if you look at the wording of this, both these things must take place, the fall in the way and the man of sin be revealed.
But what the preacher and crowd says is this. When it says a fall in the way first, they say that's referring to the rapture.
You say, how is a fallen away referring to the rapture? Now, let me say this. When I'm talking about how to prove a posterior rapture,
I'm talking about how to prove a posterior rapture to someone who is saved as willing to receive the word of God.
But I'm not saying you debate someone, say a person, on the streets. They need to hear the gospel.
I'm talking about someone who maybe has heard this teaching and they're confused.
But the preacher and crowd says the fall in the way first is the rapture. You say, how do they get that?
Because if you look up fall away or fall in the way throughout the Bible, you don't get any context of the reintroduction.
What do they do? Well, they go back to the Greek. Isn't that the secret solution when you can't prove it in English?
Go back to the Greek. That's what they do. They go back to the Greek and they say, well, in the Greek, falling away means rapture.
Basically, the word apostasia can refer to a fall in the way or can refer to a rapture.
Isn't it amazing how they just go to another language and say this word can mean whatever we want it to mean?
That's what they say. Now, there's many problems with this because the context still doesn't work for them.
Let's say, for example, the fall in the way was referring to the rapture. Well, there's a problem.
The man of sin must be revealed before that day comes. It's both those things.
It's not just the falling away first. The man of sin must also be revealed from the context.
And so if we don't know who the Antichrist is, Jesus cannot come back right now.
When you just read this and take it at face value in the English, what do you see?
You see the fall in the way takes first, where there's a great departing from the faith, and the man of sin, the Antichrist, is revealed first.
That is not taking place, so Jesus cannot come back at any moment.
That's what we see here in 2 Thessalonians 2. Verse number 4.
And let me say this. Pre-Trib crowd believes the Antichrist reveals himself midway through the seven-year period.
Now, when you read this verse, it's clear the man of sin must be revealed before that day comes.
And they agree the Antichrist comes three and a half years in.
And then you're just like, what's the problem then?
It's like the man of sin is revealed first midway through.
We agree with you in the midst of that seven-year period, and that must take place first before the day comes.
So where's the confusion? It's like the Antichrist hasn't revealed himself.
He hasn't declared himself to be God yet, okay?
So how in the world are you getting to preach your rapture?
Well, I mean, obviously, they just want to hold to it.
But even if the fall in the way was referring to the departure of the rapture, it wouldn't make sense in this context,
because the man of sin must be revealed first.
That's what we see before that day comes, before the gathering together underway.
Because if you go back to verse 1, it's talking about the coming of the Lord Jesus Christ and the gathering.
These are one thing, the coming and the rapture that are taking place.
Look at verse number 4.
Who opposeth and exalteth himself above all that is called, or that is worshiped,
so that he as God sitteth in the temple of God, showing himself that he is God.
Someone's going to declare himself to be God.
This is not the appointed son of God on earth.
It's not the Antichrist.
He can break your heart.
It breaks my heart too, but it's not referring to him.
The Bible's going to refer to somebody who's very powerful, very famous,
and he's going to declare himself to be God.
He's going to show himself to be God.
That's not taking place yet.
Now, if you go throughout history, a lot of people have claimed to be God that were false.
There's many Antichrists revealed in this world.
There's a famous one in history that takes place before the New Testament
and then after the book of Malachi, Antiochus Epiphanes.
And basically, he's kind of like a foreword of the book, but David actually prophesies about that,
where basically he slew a pig on the altar, which was an unclean animal,
and basically he was forcing all the Jews to basically reject their religion.
And it's known as, you know, that was kind of like a type of this event,
where he's declaring himself to be God.
But here in verse 4, it's referring to the Antichrist that's going to show himself to be God,
declare himself to be God in the temple of God.
That's not taking place yet.
Remember ye not that when I was yet with you, I told you these things?
So in verse 5, he's like, don't you remember?
I already told you this.
I told you these things before.
That that man of sin must be revealed first.
Today cannot come back. It's not an imminent return.
The following way takes place first.
Before. That's why the day of Christ is not at hand.
It can't be at hand if things must take place first.
The Antichrist must be revealed first before Jesus can come back.
Now, we'll go to 1 Thessalonians at the end of the sermon.
But he's like, I already told you this, Church of Thessalonians.
Because 1 Thessalonians talks about the end times,
and it talks about the rapture, and it's pretty clear.
Verse number 6,
And now ye know what withholdeth that ye might be revealed at this time.
For the mystery of Nick believed doth already work,
only he who now leadeth will lead until he be taken out of the way.
And then shall that wicked be revealed whom the Lord shall consume with the spirit of his mouth,
and shall destroy with the brightness of his coming.
This is the wicked being revealed.
Look, the Antichrist will reveal himself to be the Antichrist.
He's going to declare himself to be God.
He's going to be a false Christ, declaring himself to be God,
and look throughout the world.
And the Christians are waiting for a pre-tribulate relational rapture return.
The Muslims are waiting for their Great One to come.
The Hindus are waiting for that great manifestation of God to come.
All the religions in the world are waiting for this one person
to bring world peace.
And it's going to take place.
It's going to be Antichrist.
He's going to bring world peace and just take people like us.
That's what's going to take place.
Everyone's looking for world peace.
Look, there's going to come someone who's going to bring that world peace.
He's going to declare himself to be God.
And all the religions, Islam, Hinduism, Buddhism,
you know, most so-called Christians are going to say,
Hey, this is the one we've been waiting for.
They're going to declare he's the one.
The Jews are waiting for it as well.
They're waiting for this.
It's not Jesus coming back.
It's the Antichrist.
That's what the Bible talks about.
He's going to bring...
By peace, he's going to destroy the world, the Bible says.
By peace, because he's going to proclaim peace and bring everyone together.
He's going to hate people like us.
Look, Paul's already told the Church of Thessalonians.
That's what it says in verse 5.
But that wicked is going to be revealed,
whom the Lord shall consume with the spirit of his mouth
and shall destroy with the brightness of his coming.
So the coming of the Lord
is going to destroy the Antichrist after he's already revealed.
Okay?
He's going to destroy the Antichrist after he's revealed,
which is three and a half years in.
Everybody agrees with that.
Look, the Antichrist must be here first.
And so his coming mentioned in verse 8
is the same coming mentioned in verse 1.
So it's like, yes, you know, I agree.
The rapture, he's going to pour out his wrath.
It's one event.
They're not separate events.
You're not seeing separate events here in the Bible.
The Antichrist, the Bible says, is going to come to make war with the saints.
Look, if all the Christians are raptured from the earth,
who's he making war with?
It doesn't make any sense.
What is he doing? Just persecuting atheists?
I mean, that doesn't make any sense.
He's going to persecute the LGBT.
Is that what's going to take place?
That doesn't make any sense.
He's coming, the Bible says, to make war with the saints.
Look, there's no saints here.
Who's he going to make war with?
It's not saying he's persecuting the Catholics because it says saints, okay?
He's talking to believers there.
If there's no saints here, who's he making war with?
It does not make any sense.
No, the Lord's going to come.
When the brightness of his coming, he's going to destroy the Antichrist.
He's going to consume the spirit of knowledge
which should destroy the brightness of his coming.
Verse 9, even him who's coming is after the working of Satan
with all power and signs and light and wonders.
So in verse 9, the Antichrist is going to be working in the same manner as Satan.
He's going to use the same lying, deceits,
the great wonders that people are going to fall for.
Throughout the Bible, don't you see
everybody wants to see a sign from heaven?
The Antichrist will provide that.
He's going to come and bring world peace
and he's going to show all these great signs and wonders
and they're going to say, man, this is God.
This is who we've been waiting for to bring all the world together.
Verse 10, and with all deceivableness about righteousness and them that perish
because they receive not the love of the truth that they might be saved.
So he's going to come, the Antichrist is going to destroy the world
and then the Lord is going to come and recompense that tribulation the Bible speaks about.
Now turn to Matthew 24.
What's my point in second Thessalonians 2?
Let no man deceive you by any means.
Don't let some famous Baptist pastor deceive you.
Don't let anybody deceive you
because unless the Antichrist is revealed
it's not going to take place.
I'll tell you what, I don't speak Greek.
Show me in English where the falling away means the rapture.
That is one of the worst arguments I've ever heard.
That doesn't make any sense whatsoever.
But it's like people do whatever they want.
Just go back to the Greek and say whatever they want to teach.
But it says that the falling away
and it says the man of sin.
Don't we see in today's world a falling away from faith?
A falling away from the word God.
A falling away from the teachings of God.
We see that in our world and it's only going to get worse.
People are rejecting the Bible, they're rejecting God
and when you reject God you're perfectly waiting for the Antichrist.
It's going to fit. It's going to work.
They're rejecting God, there's this great falling away
and eventually it's going to get so bad
the Antichrist is going to come here and bring everybody together.
World needs for everyone except people that believe in the Bible
and then you get killed just like happened in the Inquisition.
So I'm a person from the Catholic Church.
Now look at Matthew 24.
When you're explaining the rapture
if somebody is not open-minded
honestly just don't waste your time.
It's fine. If somebody wants to just believe the preacher and rapture
that's fine. The Bible is very clear on this.
If people don't want to know then that's fine.
It's not a big deal. But if they're open-minded
and you explain 2 Thessalonians 2
and show the Antichrist must come back first
they're going to be like, man that makes sense.
That is what it says. That makes more sense
than the dozen times I've read this chapter and it never made sense.
Well then you can take them to Matthew 24
which is obviously a very famous chapter
where we get this phrase after the tribulation.
Verse number 5, Matthew 24.
For many shall come in my name
saying I am Christ and shall deceive many.
And you shall hear of wars and rumors of wars.
See that you need not trouble for all these things
must come to pass but the end is not yet.
For nations shall rise against nations
and kingdom against kingdom and there shall be famines
and pestilences and earthquakes in diverse places.
All these are the beginning of sorrows.
So basically it's going to get bad during the end times.
But what's mentioned right there
that's the beginning of sorrows.
I understand we have wars from time to time
but they've been wars for thousands of years
since human history started.
I understand there's people that are hungry
people that are low with your family
but that's happened for 6,000 years.
It's going to get real bad in the end times.
These are the beginning of sorrows.
Then comes great tribulation as the Bible speaks about.
This is during the seven year time period.
And this is referred to as the beginning of sorrows.
Verse 9, then shall they deliver you up to be afflicted and shall kill you.
And you shall be hated of all nations for my name's sake.
And then shall many be offended
and shall betray one another and shall hate one another.
And many false prophets shall rise and shall deceive many
because iniquity shall abound and the love of many shall wax cold.
Now notice in verse number 9
when it talks about they shall kill you
what are they killing?
Are they killing your body or your spirit?
Killing the body.
This is physical death.
It's not spiritual death. It's physical death.
They shall kill you.
The context starting at verse 9
is physical death.
Verse 13, but he that shall endure on to the end
the same shall be saved.
Saved from what?
What's the context?
Physical death.
What's it saying?
If you endure to the end of the tribulation
you will be saved from physical death.
Has nothing to do with spiritual salvation.
Don't we believe in eternal security?
What's saved?
Do you have to endure on to the end or just believe on Jesus Christ?
You just believe on Jesus Christ.
We don't have to endure on to the end and be saved.
Look, when you believe on Jesus Christ
it's a done deal.
You're saved forever no matter what.
I give unto them eternal life and they shall never perish.
No matter whether you endure on to the end or not
we're not Calvinists.
If you believe on Jesus Christ
you're saved.
But what the Bible is saying here is
there's the beginning of sorrows before being killed
it's going to get bad
and if you endure on to the end of the tribulation
you're saved from physical death.
That's a context. It's not spiritual death.
It's physical death.
And this phrase, enduring on to the end,
appears three times in the Bible
all in the reference to the end times.
Look, if you believe in salvation by grace through faith
I don't know how you line up a preacher or rapture
with those verses.
Because if you don't understand that that's physical death
you're being spared from that
then you're saying that you have to endure on to the end
and live a good life until the day you die
doesn't make sense.
God said you're explaining this to someone who's open-minded.
Someone who's already saved.
And it makes sense to us
that you do not have to endure on to the end
because it's just believe on the Lord Jesus Christ.
And you will be saved if you last through the end of the tribulation
you will be raptured at that moment
and right after you get raptured
God will pour out His wrath on the unbelievers.
See the tribulation and the wrath are different.
See there's tribulation
and that's going to be shortened
and then God pours out His wrath
on the unbelievers left on earth.
Verse 14
Now this abomination of desolation
as I mentioned earlier
in Tychus Epiphanes
was like a type of the abomination of desolation.
But then the Antichrist will
commit the abomination of desolation.
Everybody agrees on this.
The preacher, crowd, the matcher, poster, whatever
everybody agrees. The abomination of desolation
is when the man of sin gets revealed.
This is midway through.
Everybody agrees on that too.
It's three and a half years in.
This is three and a half years in.
Now look at what it says in verse number 16.
Then let them which be in Judea
flee into the mountains.
Why are you fleeing into the mountains?
When the Antichrist reveals himself
you know it's going to get bad.
Look this is not going to be an accidental
event that nobody knows about.
Everybody's going to know about this.
You're going to find out about the Antichrist
just declaring himself to be God.
It's going to be bad.
And you're going to be persecuted for what you believe.
And they will kill you for what you believe.
Just like we talked about in the first sermon.
Just like during the Inquisition.
They will kill you for the things that you believe.
Turn to verse 21.
So what we've seen is this
that the Antichrist is revealed in verse 15
the beginning of the Antichrist is revealed
verse 21
for then shall be great tribulation.
Then shall be great tribulation.
Look the tribulation is going to
get great at that time period.
Then shall be great
tribulation such as not since the beginning
of the world to this time no more ever shall be
and except those days should
be shortened. There should
no flesh be saved. But for the
elect's sake those days shall be shortened.
What does that mean that those days are going to be shortened?
What it's saying is
unless the days of the tribulation
are shortened
no flesh, no body
is going to be saved
physically. But if God
didn't shorten those days
every one of us would be killed.
Every single one. Why? Well that's what it says.
Except those days should be shortened there should no
flesh be saved. But eventually
what's going to happen is he's going to shorten those days
and he will rapture us before the end
of the seven years.
So guess what? It's before the
wrath of God because God will pour out his wrath
on the unbelievable world that's left.
But it's after the tribulation
you say well how do you know that? Because it
mentions in verse 21 the great tribulation.
Look the rapture has not taken place
yet in this chapter. We're going to see it here.
It hasn't taken place yet. And those days
must be shortened otherwise no flesh
is going to be saved. So God will shorten
those days. Verse 29
Immediately
after the tribulation of those days
shall the sun be darkened and the moon
shall not give her light and the stars shall fall
from heaven and the powers of the heavens
shall be shamed. Let me read that again to you.
Immediately after the tribulation
Immediately after
the tribulation
It's not confusing.
It's not confusing at all. The man
of sin must be revealed first. Well that took
place in verse number
abomination of desolation was in verse 15
It mentions great tribulation in verse 21
Verse 22 Unless we shorten those
days no flesh is going to be saved. Earlier
it said those that endure at the end
shall be saved. We're talking about physically being
saved. Then we see
after the tribulation
in verse 29
After the tribulation. Not before.
Now I did hear one person
make this argument. They were trying to defend the
preacher rapture and they went back
to the Greek and they said
this word after in its original
context. It's not just referring
to like a direct moment like it's taking place
but it's the whole event
together. So basically
it can take place
before and still use the
word after. I mean it was like a long
tentative explanation and I'm just like
maybe I'm just a simple
person. To me I learned the word after
when I was a kid. To me that means
after the tribulation is tribulation and
afterwards the sun is darkened
and the moon shall not give
her light and the stars shall fall from heaven and the powers
of the heavens shall be shaken. Let me ask you
has the sun been darkened?
As it's mentioned to you.
Now it's not talking about a one time event.
I understand there's things that take place.
Have you seen this take place when the sun's
darkened and the moon doesn't give her light and the stars
fall from heaven and the powers of the heavens
shall be shaken? Has that taken place yet?
No it hasn't.
Why hasn't it not taken place?
Well first the antichrist must be revealed.
That hasn't happened either.
Verse 30
Then shall all the tribes of the earth
mourn and they shall see the son of
man coming to the clouds of heaven with power
and great glory.
Then you see the sign
of the son of man in heaven.
Look that's not going to come take place
until the powers are shaken
the antichrist reveals himself
there are things that must take place
and when does this take place?
After the tribulation it said in verse 29
you say well how do you know this is the rapture?
Verse 31
They shall gather together his elect
from the four winds
from one end of heaven to the other.
Gather together his elect.
That sounds like the rapture to me.
He's gathered together all the people
they're going to be brought to heaven
this is after the tribulation.
Look the sun must be darkened first.
These things must take place first.
Now if you listen to preacher and people
they have all kinds of weird explanations
because just reading it
the beginning of sorrows
the end to be physically saved
red tribulation
except those days should be shortened no flesh to save
then it says after the tribulation
and then you see the sign of the son of man in heaven.
Now keep in mind
how does this chapter start?
This chapter starts where his
closest followers are asking
hey can you tell us about your coming back?
That's how the chapter starts.
They want to know
hey can you tell us about when you come back?
And he says hey all these things must take place first.
Look there's no evidence
that there's multiple comings here.
They're asking for the coming
your coming tell us about it.
And he's like all these things are going to take place first.
But you hear a lot of weird explanations
and you say how do they get around these?
Well look at verse 36 first.
Verse 36.
They try to negate everything I just preached
for the last 15 minutes with one verse.
They say but of the day
in verse 36 but of the day and hour
knoweth no man
no not the angels of heaven
but my father only.
They say well we don't know the day or the hour
so that means it can happen right now.
Because we don't know the day or the hour.
Now look I think it's weird when you have
verse after verse after verse
saying one thing and then you try to use one verse
to negate everything.
But what is the context of that day and hour?
Look the context is not broken
in this chapter.
The context goes back to verse 29
when it's immediately after the tribulation.
Look I agree that I don't know
the day or the hour when he comes back.
I'm never going to set a date on the rapture.
But even though I don't know the day or the hour
there is one thing I do know.
It's happening after the tribulation.
Look you cannot know the day and the hour
but still be aware it happens after the tribulation.
And
when you look at the context
it goes back to the context of verse 29.
What's weird is that preacher and people
will quote verse 36 and just pretend
Matthew 24 doesn't exist.
They try to go back to Matthew 24 and say
no no no that doesn't apply.
This is just written to the Jews.
It doesn't apply to us.
It's like well why are you quoting Matthew 24?
That's the best they got.
Now how do we know that this wasn't written to the Jews?
We'll turn to Mark 13 and I'll prove it to you.
Mark 13.
Now one reason we know this was not just written to the Jews
is because that
he's telling
they say well this is just written to his
apostles. Well the problem is
one of the apostles was Simon the
Canaanite.
Simon the Canaanite
not Simon the Jew.
And what does the preacher and crowd say?
Well they say well that's just a title.
So what if you call me
Matthew the American?
It's just a title. No.
Call me Matthew the Spaniard.
It's just a title.
Just call me Matthew the Spaniard.
Just call me Matthew the German.
Wouldn't you assume
if you called me Matthew the Spaniard
that I was Spanish?
Or I at least had strong
Hispanic descent?
When you call someone
you say Matthew the American it makes sense.
You say why? Because I'm an American.
That's where I'm from.
Now look if you call Simon the Canaanite
why in the world would you use a title
that doesn't make any sense whatsoever?
I guess you got to go back to the Greek
on that one as well.
How do you know it was not just written
the Jews are not just written to us 12 Apostles
besides the fact that there's Simon the Canaanite
as one of those 12.
The parallel chapter in the book of Mark
is Mark 13.
They try to negate this entire chapter
and say this is just written to a select group of people.
So for a select group of people
I'm going to talk to you about the rapture that's for you
but not for all the other believers in the world.
Well what is the last verse
in Mark 13?
The last verse
I say unto you
I say unto all
What?
He's like what I'm telling you I'm telling everybody.
Well the all there doesn't really mean all.
It just means some.
Now we're cowboys.
It's like you can't have your cake and eat it too.
It says what I say unto you I say unto all.
He's telling everybody. You say why?
Because God wants people to be aware about this.
He wants us to be aware that the Antichrist
is coming first. There's going to be great tribulation
it's going to get bad, it's going to get tough
and then you're going to see
look his disciples ask him
they say tell us of thy coming and of the end of the age
tell us about it.
What does he do? He tells them.
Look if I was in that crowd
and I was listening to him
and that wasn't really referring to his coming
it's just like for a special group of people
I'd be so confused.
Jesus is explaining in Matthew 24 and Mark 13
about his coming and he's saying there's going to be
tribulation first and the beginning of sorrows
there's going to be signs up in heaven
this is taking place before he comes back
say well how do you do that?
Turn to Revelation 6
So I would suggest starting in 2 Thessalonians 2
and then I'd suggest going to Matthew 24
Now look if they just reject all of that
and they say well you know
I don't immediately after the tribulation
I still think that's before
I think that's mistranslated
whatever they want to say
they're probably not going to change their mind about it.
It's fine it is what it is
But what you have to understand in Matthew 24
when I talk about the sun being darkened
the moon not given light
the signs up in heaven
this is going to be parallel with the section in
Revelation chapter 6
Now I personally would start in 2 Thessalonians 2
but you could choose to start in Revelation 6
before you go to Matthew 24
these are parallel so you're going to go to both places
either one of these I think is fine for the second one
But Revelation 6 verse 9
Keep in mind the first seal
is going to basically be setting off
the beginning of the seven year time period
And Revelation chapter 6 verse 9
When we had opened the fifth seal
I saw under the altar the souls of them
that were slain for the word of God
for the testimony which they held
and they cried with a loud voice saying
how long will the Lord holy and true
dost thou not judge and abinge our blood
on them that dwell on the earth
And so what do we see in verse 9
We see martyrs for the cause of Christ
in Revelation 6 and 9
And what did it say in verse 10
How long is it going to be Lord
until you are abinged our blood
on them that dwell on the earth
Translation, you have not poured out your wrath yet
When are you going to come back and pour out your wrath
These are not people that were raptured
These are people that were slain
killed
And how long is it going to be until you come back
and pour out your wrath
on those that have killed us unjustly
Why is it that they were able to kill them unjustly
Because the anti-crisis is basically in power
And the evil people rule the world at this time
And so they are killing and martyring like us
Verse number 11
And white robes were given unto every one of them
And it was said unto them that they should rest yet
for a little season until their fellow servants also
of their brethren that should be killed as they were
should be fulfilled
Now he held them in the sixth seal
and lo there was a great earthquake
and the sun became black
as sackcloth of hair
and the moon became his blood
Doesn't that sound like what we saw in Matthew 24
The sun becoming black and the moon becoming his blood
You say why?
Because these are parallel to one another
And you can line up Matthew 24 with Revelation 6
and you can see these seals are lining up perfectly
What was the context in Matthew 24?
After the tribulation
Okay
So this is in Revelation chapter 6
and we're seeing these signs
these cosmic signs
Notice what it says in verse 13
And every mountain and island were moved out of their places
And the kings of the earth and the great men
and the rich men and the chief captains and the mighty men
and every bondman and every free man
hid themselves in the dens and in the rocks of the mountains
and said to the mountains and rocks
fall on us and hide us from the face of him
that sitteth on the throne for the wrath of the land
for the great day of his wrath is come
and who shall be able to stand
What is it saying?
All these things were prophesied in his great day
and his wrath has come
to take place
All these signs must take place first
and once these signs come true
all the evil people are like, oh man
That's what the Bible spoke about
Now they're afraid. They're fleeing to the mountains
See, earlier it tells us to flee the mountains
And now what happens?
Now they're fleeing to the mountains. Why?
Because they know the Lord's about to come back
The corral is wrathful
Now, look at Revelation chapter 7
Actually, look at Revelation 8 verse 1
Revelation 8 verse 1
Now, in Revelation chapter 6
we saw the six seals
and this lines up with Matthew 24
because it's not taking place yet
And we saw that his great day of his wrath has come
So basically his wrath is about to be poured out
We're going to skip a chapter for a second
I want you to notice the first verse in Revelation 8
Revelation 8 verse 1
And when he had opened the seventh seal
there was silence in heaven about the space
and half an hour
Now, I find it interesting
that the six seals went by like this
and then all of a sudden a whole chapter goes by
before the seventh seal
And what happens at the opening of the seventh seal?
There's silence in heaven about the space
and half an hour. Why is there silence for half an hour?
See, from my perspective
the seventh seal is pretty significant
because this is when rapture
that he pours out is wrath
It makes sense that this is one of the biggest events
in the history of the world
There's silence in heaven for a half hour
because it's a big event
But for the preacher of ground, this is just another seal being opened
Why is there silence for this seal?
What's so significant about the seventh seal?
There's nothing significant about it
It's very significant though
if you're post-trip
If you believe in a pre-rap post-trip rapture
because this is the event
where there's silence in heaven for half an hour
This is the event where there's a rapture and he pours out his wrath
But my question is this
Why did the whole chapter go by
when the moment was about to take place?
Why is it that it was about to take place
and a whole chapter goes by?
Well in this chapter in a moment of time
quite a bit of stuff happens
Revelation 7
Remember this is after the sixth seal
before he pours out his wrath
before he raptures and then pours out his wrath
Revelation 7 verse 9
After this I beheld
and lo a great multitude
which no man can number
of all nations and kindreds and people and tongues
stood before the throne and before the land
clothed with white robes and palms in their hands
a great multitude which no man can number
Look in the Bible
they number some pretty big amounts
This is an amount
no man can number
Look this is a lot of people
This is the rapture that's taking place
All these people are going up in heaven
and they come from
it says in verse 9
all nations and kindreds
and people and tongues
from everywhere
You say why?
There's saved people in every single country in the world
Every single country
except Vatican City was not a country
Every single country
there's a saved person
There's people saved all over the world
who speak every language
Why? Because God is the way to get his gospel out to the ends of the world
There's a great multitude which no man can number
in verse 9
and cried with a loud voice saying
salvation you are God who sitteth upon the throne
and under the land
and all the angels stood round about the throne
and about the elders and the poor beasts
saying amen blessing and glory
and wisdom and thanksgiving and honor and power
and might and wonder of God forever and ever
Amen
Now my question is where did this great multitude come from?
Well verse number 12
and one of the elders answered saying on me
what are these which are arrayed in white robes
and whence came they?
So one of the elders up in heaven
asked John
Hey where did these people come from?
Who are these people arrayed in white robes?
Where did they come from?
Verse 14
And I said unto him, Sir thou knowest
and he said to me
these are they which came out
of great tribulation
and have washed their robes
and made them light in the blood
of the Lamb
A great multitude which no man can number
It's the rapture
It's very clear
Where did they come from?
Out of great tribulation
Preacher crowd get around this
Honestly I've never really heard
them give an explanation
The best explanation they do is some of them believe in
like four raptures, five raptures, six raptures
I mean
I guess just add as many raptures as you need
Try to confuse them
It's kind of like an evolutionist that just keeps putting
a zero on the end to say
however old they want to say it is
four and a half billion years old right now I think it is
It'll be like ten billion years in a couple years
You know it's ridiculous
The sign of thy coming
One coming, that's the context always
These are a great multitude which no man can number
This of every nation, every kindred
and they came out of great tribulation
It's not a local rapture
They come from every nation, every kindred
every tongue, everywhere
They came out of great tribulation
God
Remember in Revelation 6
When are you going to pour out your judgment God?
That's what they're asking, those that have been martyred
And then in Revelation 7 we see the rapture
And then when you go to Revelation 8
verse 1
That is when he's going to pour out his wrath
It's crystal clear in Revelation 6
It's not a confusing concept
Now turn to 1 Thessalonians
1 Thessalonians
2 Thessalonians 2
Matthew 24 and Revelation 6
When you show people that
Look if they're open minded they are going to confer on it
It's very clear
It's like how many verses do you need to show
It's like when we preach the gospel
Look if we explain that salvation is a free gift
And you've explained several verses in Romans
and John
Look you don't have to go to Genesis, and then Exodus
and then Leviticus, and then Numbers
and then Ephraim, and Joshua
Look they're not going to get saved
Some people just, they're not going to change their mind
It is what it is, that's fine
But if you show them those places
That's a wealth of information there
Now almost everybody
When they read the book of Revelation
They're going to agree on one thing
I'm so confused when I'm reading the book of Revelation
Now here's the thing, I'm not confused reading the book of Revelation
Right
Because it's not complicated
Now look I'm not saying I understand all of the symbolism
But the timing of the rapture
It's not complicated
Right
And quite honestly so many people are confused
And the reason why they're confused is because
They're hearing a preacher of rapture being taught
And it never makes sense
I mean it's got more holes in it than a slice of Swiss cheese
There's so many problems with the preacher of rapture
They're bouncing all around, they say
Well you know, hear the word coming means this
Go back to the Greek here
Four raptures, that's what Peter read at the top
There's like four raptures in the book of Revelation
Like what in the world?
It's like the Bible's meant to be simple
It's meant to be easy to understand
It's not complicated, now remember in 2 Thessalonians 2
What he told the church of Thessalonica
Is that remember
When I was with you I told you these things
So let's go back to 1 Thessalonians
And let's see everything
That he taught them in 1 Thessalonians
Now quite honestly the chapters we looked at
That should be enough in Birmingham
That was enough for my wife when I showed her that
I can't remember if I showed her other places
I explained stuff, other things to her
But you know in Matthew 24, 2 Thessalonians 2
And then Revelation 6 up to chapter 8 verse 1
That should be enough for people that are with mine
Let's see what it says in 1 Thessalonians 1
Verse 6
What did he teach the church of Thessalonica?
Verse 6
So the church of Thessalonica
They had afflictions
They had persecutions
They had tribulation
That's what we see in chapter 1
Turn to chapter 3
And it says in chapter 3 verse 1
Why do they need comfort?
Because they're going through persecution
Now this is not the end times tribulation
But what you see throughout the Bible
Is God's people always go through tribulation
They always go through persecution
Throughout the Bible
Every single book of the Bible God's people go through persecution
They go through trials
So to suggest that during the end times
There's a select group of Christians
That don't suffer any persecution
It doesn't really make a whole lot of sense
Because for over 6,000 years they're always going through persecution
Now chapter 3 verse 1
It says
Wherefore we can no longer prevail
We've got it good to be left at Athens alone
And this is comfort you concerning your faith
Verse 3
That no man should be moved by these afflictions
For yourselves know that we are appointed thereon too
We're appointed to afflictions and persecutions and trials
Verse 4
For verily when we are with you
We told you before that we should suffer tribulation
Even as it came to pass
And we know
God's people always go through tribulation
Right
This is where the preacher gets confused
The tribulation and the wrath of God are not the same thing
The tribulation is when believers go through persecutions
The wrath of God is when God pours out his wrath on believers
Don't we use John 3 to 36 often in our soloing presentation?
Those that do not get saved
He that believeth not the Son should not see light
But the wrath of God abideth on them
Forever God's wrath abides on those people in hell
Because when people do not believe on Jesus Christ
He is angry at the wicked every day
And his wrath will always abide on them
It's not God's people
Look up in heaven God's wrath doesn't abide on them
That's to those that don't believe on the Son
Because God doesn't pour out his wrath on his people
That has nothing to do with political tribulation
I've explained this to them
I've talked to pastors about this before
And they told me things like this
I just don't believe that God will set fire to building with his people inside of us
And it's like that's not what's taking place
This is not God causing us to go through tribulation
Like he's persecuting us
Like he's hunting us down
That's not what's taking place
It's the antichrist
It's the devil
It's wicked people
That's always throughout the Bible
God's people go through tribulation
They go through persecutions
Afflictions
Look at chapter 4
Now it makes sense
That he explains the rapture
To the church of Thessalonica
Because of the fact it's really the church that you notice
That's going through persecutions
And so it makes perfect sense to that church
That hey we're going through a lot of trials
And then he's explaining during the end times
Guess what?
I'm going through a lot of tribulation
And then I'm going to rapture my people
Chapter 4 verse 13
But I will not have you to be ignorant
Rather concerning them which are asleep
That you sorrow not even as others which have no hope
For if we believe that Jesus died and rose again
Even so them also which sleep in Jesus
Will God bring with him
For this we say unto you by the word of the Lord
That we which are alive and remain under the company of the Lord
Shall not prevent them which are asleep
So he's saying you know those that are alive and remain
Kind of reminds me of he that endureth
We shall be saved
Except those days should be shortened there should no flesh be saved
We which are alive and remain unto the coming of the Lord
Shall not prevent them which are asleep
Once again the coming of the Lord
It applies as one coming
Not all coming
It doesn't prevent those that are asleep
Why? Because when those that are dead
When you come back you're going to rapture them as well
You're going to come up to heaven along with us
Verse 16 he clarifies this
For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout
Because we are a danger with the trump of God
And the dead in Christ shall rise first
Then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them
In the clouds and meet the Lord in the air
And so shall we ever be with the Lord
Wherefore comfort one another with these works
Now verse 18 it says comfort one another
Look the comfort is not that you will have no tribulation
I think we're already going through tribulation
Okay it's like well why don't you take away that tribulation
And then they're coming
They're going through tribulation
The comfort is that those that are asleep
Are lost loved ones that have died
When they go to be with the Lord
They're going to come with us
That's the comfort
The comfort is not hey there's no persecution
No the comfort is not everybody knows that I've already passed away
As well
Now once you understand that this is known to be the rapture passage
And I agree with that
It doesn't explain the timing of rapture
It doesn't explain preacher
It doesn't explain posture as well
It does say alive and remain in the coming of the Lord
But you know it doesn't really give you the timing
But I want you to understand the context is not broken
Go to 1 Thessalonians 5 verse 1 and let's continue
See the chapters were added
They're helpful, they're good
But often times when you come to the end of a chapter
You need to keep reading to understand what's going on
Right
The context isn't broken
1 Thessalonians 5 verse 1
But of the times and the seasons, brethren, ye have no need that I write unto you
For yourselves know perfectly that the day of the Lord so cometh
As it be in the night
Now there's a famous movie called the chief of the night
It actually was it a couple of days ago
And I can say this is one of the worst movies I've ever seen in my life
I always thought it was a really low budget
But it's just like everybody's just raptured out of the world
And everyone's like where is everybody
Oh no
And it's just like everybody gets raptured
And then people are left behind
They're crying, they're weeping
It's like man I mocked this pre-tribulation rapture
It came to pass, it's true
By the way the person who did that movie
When you watch it, there's pretty much more salvation in that movie as well
But you know it's a really low budget
But he's kind of like left behind
But even more low budget than that
But what they say is the movie's called a thief in the night
Basically what they say is
That it can come back at any moment
Thief in the night, okay
Well I want you to understand that God clarifies
What it means by thief in the night
Notice verse 3
For when they shall say peace and safety
Then sudden destruction cometh upon them
As travail upon a woman's child
And they shall not escape
When it says a thief in the night
It's not that it comes unexpectedly
It comes quickly
It happens really quickly
That's what's taking place
Because when a thief robs you at night
They don't stop eating a ham sandwich
I'm going to stop and cook something in the microwave
Just spend some time in here
You know what I'm saying
They just quickly rob you and get out
Because otherwise you'll catch them
They come as a thief in the night
What do they do? They quickly come in
They come out
And what does it say in verse 4?
This proves that it cannot just come unawares to us
Because in verse 4
But ye brethren are not in darkness
That they should overtake you as a thief
Look we're not in darkness
We're aware of these things
It can't just come at any moment
Unexpectedly we didn't see it coming
No we're not in darkness
That they should overtake us as a thief
Why? Because he explained very thoroughly
Things that must take place first
But it can't just come as a thief in the night right now
I say why?
We're not in darkness where it can just come
Yes we don't know the day or the hour
But what we do know is the man of sin is revealed first
And once that takes place
All of a sudden it's making us aware of these things
Ok we're getting closer
And then people start reading the book of Revelation
The book of Daniel probably a lot more
Get a better understanding of these things
And you're seeing things come to pass
Bob will be very specific about these things
There are complicated things in Daniel with Revelation
The timing of the rapture is not one of those things
But there are complicated things
And I'm sure as we get closer to the end times
There's verses that are going to make more sense to us
Than to do now
I'm sure when John was writing this
He was probably confused about a lot of us
But as we get closer
We can see these things coming to pass
Now notice what it says in verse 9
1 Thessalonians 5 verse 9
For God hath not appointed us to wrath
But to obtain us from the dead
Not appointed us to wrath
But to obtain salvation by our Lord Jesus Christ
One of the big preachers arguments
Is that we're saying
You go through the wrath of God
That is not what we're saying
Now look when it comes to being post-tribulation
There are other people that are post-tribulation
Post-wrath
We are not like that
Generally the Calvinists believe in a post-tribulation
Post-wrath rapture
At least in America
Here they like to be everything
So I don't know what they teach
But we don't believe that because it says
We're not appointed unto wrath in verse 9
We're not saying that God's people are going to be persecuted by God
We're saying we're persecuted by the antichrists
And the devil and the forces in place
But notice how it says we're not appointed to wrath
But I want you to go back
To verse 3 of 1 Thessalonians
1 Thessalonians 3 verse 3
1 Thessalonians chapter 3 verse 3
We are not appointed to wrath
Let me show you something we are appointed to
1 Thessalonians chapter 3 verse 3
That no man should be moved by these afflictions
For yourself to know that we are appointed thereon to
We are not appointed to wrath
We're appointed to affliction
Persecution
And trials and tribulations
Just as every prophet in the Old Testament
Went through persecutions
Just as the great men of God
Historically speaking
Assuming it is true
Most of them were martyred to death
I don't know that
But if tradition serves us correct
And I would believe that
Because of the persecution from the Catholic Church
Before that with the Roman Empire
It makes sense to me
Look we are appointed to tribulation
And affliction
We're not appointed to wrath
Because that's God pouring out his wrath
But we do go through tribulation and trials and inflations
Now turn to 2 Thessalonians
And let's look at 2 Thessalonians one last place
Chapter 1 verses 4 through 10
2 Thessalonians 1 verse 4
So that we ourselves glory in you
In the churches of God through your patience and faith
In all your persecutions and tribulations
That ye endure
Now remember in 1 Thessalonians
He talks to them about the rapture
And how you're appointed to affliction
Then he talks about persecutions and tribulations
Verse 5
Which is the manifest token of the righteous judgment of God
That he may be counted worthy of the kingdom of God
For which he also suffered
Seeing it as a righteous thing with God
To recompense tribulation to them that trouble you
God is going to recompense tribulation
God's pattern
Is he allows his people to go through tribulation
And then he comes and he evens the score
Then he pours out the wrath on those wicked people
But he allows us to go through tribulation first
All of us
All that will live godly in Christ Jesus
Shall suffer persecution
Except during the end times
All the millions of the rapture
None of them will live for any persecution
Because during the end times you get no persecution whatsoever
No God's people will live for persecution
That's what says we're appointed there understood
Verse 6
He says he's going to recompense tribulation
To those that trouble us
Verse 7
And to you who are troubled rest with us
We get to rest
When the Lord Jesus is revealed
When he comes back
And every eye shall see him
Even though people say nobody's going to know
Though every eye shall see him
Verse 8
Inflaming fire taking vengeance on them that know not God
And that obey not the gospel of our Lord Jesus Christ
Who shall be punished with everlasting destruction
From the presence of the Lord
And from the glory of his power
When he shall come to be glorified in the saints
And to be admired in all that we believe
Because our testimony among you was believed in that day
He will come back
Be glorified in his saints
And he will recompense tribulation
First the tribulation
Takes place
Now look this sermon is not
This is kind of the same information
A lot of you already know
But this sermon was meant to show you how you can teach something
This is what I've done
I've chosen 2 Thessalonians 2
2 Thessalonians 2
Matthew 24
Thessalonians 6 up to 8 verse 1
Those are like your heavy weight scriptures to show
Now during the conversation
This is what's going to take place
If they're open minded
They'll start to ask you questions
Because they're going to assume the tribulation and the wrath
Are both seven years
They think they're the same thing
They don't understand the tribulation gets short
They think the whole time is God's wrath
They think that what we're saying is that we're going through God's wrath
That's not what we're saying
They are confused by a lot of different things
And so some people don't believe
A post-tribulation rapture
Not because it's that complicated
But just because they were never taught
And they're confused
They've heard a lot of false things
And so when you're talking to them
They're going to start asking you some questions
Now here's the key though
You need to be able to answer those questions
You don't want to be able to say
Here's a sermon to listen to
Here's a documentary you can watch
You need to be able to actually teach them
And everything that I teach at this church
You need to not just believe things
You need to know how to teach things
You need to know where to turn
Not just that if somebody tries
To confuse you
That you're going to still stick to what you believe
No, you need to be able to actually
Teach people
And that's when you show that you really understand it very well
I don't want people to just be
Zombies, just brother stuffies and this
That's really true
No, you need to know what you believe
And look, if you disagree with me, that's fine
Read those chapters, read Matthew 24
2 Thessalonians 2
Revelation 6, 7, and 8
And whatever conclusion you come to
That's fine, you need to know for yourselves
You say, I believe this very strongly
You need to know how to teach it
And if you don't know how to teach it
And a lot of this stuff is new information to you
You need to actually sit down and read those chapters
And understand how you're going to show somebody
So let's give the Word prayer
Dear Heavenly Father, thank you for allowing us to be here today
And just your Word
That was always precious and great to us, God
You know, it's something that we've experienced